473: Breathe Better, Run Better

Breathing is something we do every moment of every day, yet most runners never give it a second thought. If you've ever found yourself gasping for air during an easy run, battling a painful side stitch, or wondering whether you're "supposed" to breathe through your nose, this episode is for you.

In this conversation, Angie and Kevin explore why breathing is one of the most overlooked skills in running—and one that can have a surprisingly big impact on how your runs feel. They explain why breathing isn't about chasing perfection or overthinking every inhale and exhale. Instead, it's about helping your body work more efficiently so running feels smoother, easier, and more sustainable.

You'll learn how your breathing influences everything from endurance and running economy to nervous system regulation and recovery. Angie also shares why learning to use your diaphragm changed her own running experience, while Kevin explains the simple techniques that helped him overcome side stitches early in his running journey. Whether you're a brand-new runner or someone who's been logging miles for years, this episode offers practical tools that can improve both your running and everyday life.

00:00 Why breathing deserves more attention in running

04:00 Research on dysfunctional breathing in endurance athletes

09:00 How breathing affects endurance, effort, recovery, and performance

12:00 Common breathing mistakes runners make

16:00 Side stitches: why they happen and what current research says

23:00 Preventing side stitches before they start

26:00 What to do when a side stitch strikes mid-run

30:00 Diaphragmatic breathing and 360-degree breathing explained

35:00 Breathing, core stability, strength training, and mobility

39:00 Nose breathing vs. mouth breathing

43:00 Step-by-step breathing drills to practice

48:00 Box breathing, 4-7-8 breathing, physiological sigh, and pursed-lip breathing

55:00 How to incorporate breathing practice into your training without overthinking it

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Transcript

angie 0:01

So you've done it 20,000 times today without thinking, or maybe yesterday you did it about 20,000 times without even thinking about it. So why are we talking about it, and what is it that we're talking about? We are talking about your breathing, because breathing is one of the most trainable performance variables that most runners never really think about or don't do enough work to try to improve. So today we're gonna talk about why it matters, why it's so important for you to train your breathing as a runner, how it can help you, how to do that, and lots of fun techniques to deal with some of the breathing problems like side stitches and those kinds of things along the way. We'll answer mouth breathing versus nose breathing, and diaphragmatic breathing, all sorts of fun breathing topics today. So stay tuned. What's up, runners? Welcome back to the show. It's episode number 473. Kev, we are quickly approaching 500 episodes of this podcast.

kevin 1:24

I know. It feels like we're almost doing, a whole episode every week at that rate.

angie 1:28

It's wild. What do you mean every week?

kevin 1:30

Cause that's how often we do podcasts. Like-

angie 1:33

I know.

kevin 1:34

I know. Never-

angie 1:34

I missed the reference.

kevin 1:35

I, sorry, I was trying to make a joke. It just didn't land very well.

angie 1:38

I know.

kevin 1:38

Anyway, we're breathing.

angie 1:39

We're breathing today. All right. today we're gonna talk all about breathing, and this is one of those things that we often take for granted as runners, because it's something that we do every single day without thinking about it, both in running and outside of running, and it is an involuntary process, thank goodness, because if it was a voluntary process, there would be a lot less humans in the world. This is an- involuntary process, meaning your body just does it without you ever having to think about it. It is automatic.

kevin 2:09

Yeah. Because of that, I'm a little skeptical of this entire episode. I'm just gonna tell you that.

angie 2:15

Ooh. Ooh, yay.

kevin 2:17

Like-

angie 2:17

What do you mean s- skeptical?

kevin 2:18

I appreciate some of the things in it, but so much of the, this is the correct way to breathe when you're running." At, at some point, it overcomplicates it- Got it because it's an involuntary action.

angie 2:31

Yeah. I agree, and I think that, like anything in running, we can overcomplicate a- almost all of it, right? And I think that we wanna definitely be aware of that, and I think that's great that you brought that up right at the beginning of the episode, because we can definitely overcomplicate it and overthink it, and at the same time, it is something that we can train and improve. And I know this firsthand, because when I was a f- a new runner, Kevin really helped me with this issue for myself, because I was getting a lot of side stitches. I felt like I was always out of breath. My endurance was terrible, and Kevin taught me some cool tricks from his years of just being a runner, and all of the coaches and people that have helped him throughout his running career, and he really helped me with a lot of things, and I'm gonna be teaching you guys, we are gonna be teaching you guys some of those things in this episode, because they made a huge difference in how running felt for me.

kevin 3:26

Yeah, I think part of my skepticism comes from, the fact that I haven't struggled with things like a side stitch in almost 30-ish years.

angie 3:36

You don't think you've had a s- one single side stitch in 30 years?

kevin 3:41

Not that I've struggled with.

angie 3:42

Okay.

kevin 3:43

It's that some of these techniques that I've picked up are now such second nature to me that I don't- Yeah even think of them as, breathing techniques. I just think it, they become just a whole bunch of tools that I have easy access to.

angie 3:55

Yes.

kevin 3:56

Yeah, and- So I think it's a worthwhile podcast, but at the same time, you can definitely overcomplicate an involuntary process.

angie 4:06

I agree, and I do think, though, that I'm glad that you mention that, because I think that's a huge part of it, because you have been doing so many of these things- For so long. They have become just involuntary for you. You don't have to think about them. They have become more automatic. And that's really our goal for all of our listeners as well, all of you listening to this, is when you start to learn some of these techniques and you start to practice these techniques, the goal of practice is always to make those things become more automatic. And as they become more automatic, they are going to help you in ways that you don't even realize. And so let's first talk about why your breathing matters so much in sp- specifically in running. Obviously, breathing is important. Breathing gets oxygen down to your working muscles. But when you start running, your ventilation rate jumps about 25 times versus when you're at rest. So when you are at rest, you take in about approximately six liters of air per minute at rest, and that goes up to 150 liters per minute at a hard effort. Now, this is not easy running. We're talking about a hard effort. But still, that is a huge jump in just the amount of air that you're taking in. And so when you have a dysfunctional breathing pattern and you're taking in all of this air, you're not using it appropriately. And so the more efficient, even if you can just improve that by a little bit, if you can make your breathing more efficient and you're able to actually extract the oxygen from the air that you're breathing in more effectively, that's going to improve a lot of things in your running.

kevin 5:44

Yeah, it's the trickle-down effect. And so you did some looking up and background into this. Some research. And the, it's the next point that you made that really pulled me in. Yeah. That nearly half of elite endurance athletes have dysfunctional breathing patterns. This was a thing that came out in 2024, and it's only looking at elite endurance athletes. And half of them had, had what was characterized as a dysfunctional breathing pattern. I'm curious what all that entails- that is a dysfunctional pattern. But if you're talking about the best of the best endurance runners are coin toss not breathing correctly, you gotta assume that most of your everyday runners have at least s- room for improvement, we could say.

angie 6:30

I agree. and it definitely does matter with how they qualify a dysfunctional breathing pattern. So in this specific study that we're referring to, they categorized breathing patterns into three main types, and we're gonna be talking about different breathing patterns, later in the episode. But in this re- research pattern, they, the diaphragmatic breathing pattern was the only one that was categorized as a functional breathing pattern. So are you doing actual diaphragmatic breathing? The second category was thoracic breathing, which is when you take a deep breath, your chest and shoulders rise up, and you don't see any of the belly involved in that breath. And then in the third group, which was also categorized as dysfunctional, it was abdominal only is the way that they characterize it. But basically, you breathe in and expansion of the belly, but you also see, chest and shoulders rising up as well. So it's a breath all over the place. And they cr- categorize those last two as dysfunctional breathing patterns And they found that, 40, was it 44.92% of the elite athletes that they studied, which were all Polish endurance athletes on national teams, were part of the dysfunctional breathing pattern group, whereas the rest of them w- so what's that, 65% or 55% were diaphragmatic breathing patterns, more functional. And the diaphragmatic breathing pattern that we're going to describe to you guys in a little bit, was shown to have better pulmonary test results, like pulmonary function tests, which is one of the ways there was multiple pulmonary function tests that they did, and they scored better in all... not all of them, but multiple of those, function testings. So they concluded that the diaphragmatic test or the diaphragmatic breathing pattern was more functional and fort- almost 45% of people of elite athletes were not doing that properly. And so that number has to be even higher for recreational athletes and then even higher for sedentary individuals that don't exercise at all. And kind of the author's conclusion from that is training this breathing pattern could really help, and obviously this individual study did not go into, what does that mean? just because you h- you show a dysfunctional breathing pattern, what does that actually mean? Does that mean that you don't perform as well? Does it mean that you have a increased risk of injury? And this study did not go into that, and that's what future studies they recommended, start to investigate. but there's a link here. there's a link in the way that we breathe, and it's not like there's a right way and a wrong way, but there's probably a way and a better way so that you can actually use that breathing and that oxygen more effectively to improve some of the areas that we're gonna talk about today.

kevin 9:07

Yeah, like everybody's breathing. we all make it through the day-

angie 9:09

Right

kevin 9:10

without, "Oh, shoot, I forgot to breathe," and then just drop to the ground and passed out.

angie 9:13

There

kevin 9:13

may be, like, a better way of doing it- especially when it comes to sports. When you talk about taking in such a massive required ventilation- there may be a more efficient way to do it, and this is where you get into diaphragmatic breathing because the diaphragm is a muscle. Like all the other muscles in your body- you can train it. You can improve its efficiency, its resiliency. you can train the diaphragm- which is really helpful. And I remember doing this-

angie 9:38

Yeah

kevin 9:39

back in my teens.

angie 9:40

And the cool thing about breathing is that it's the only autonomic function that you can consciously control. So it has a direct line to your nervous system. We all know that- When we slow down and take some deep breaths, we feel more calm, right? you take three deep breaths and you are cal- like, you just feel more relaxed and more calm. You can use your breathing to slow down things like your heart rate. You can use your breathing to slow down things like when your brain is spiraling out of control. And you can't consciously control your heart rate, right? You can't say, "Heart, beat faster. Heart, beat slower." But you can consciously control your breathing, and then that breathing will have an effect on your heart rate and other things like digestion and all sorts of other bodily processes. And so this is why breathing is so im- important, because it gives us that direct line to helping to control our nervous system.

kevin 10:34

Wouldn't it be cool if we could control other autonomic functions?

angie 10:38

It could be. I feel like that would be way too much to think about, though.

kevin 10:42

just- But like maybe you might-

angie 10:42

If you just had to think about how to, speed up your heart, speed it up, slow it down, that just would take all of your brainpower.

kevin 10:48

No, they'd be running in the background. if you start- Yeah running faster, you're naturally gonna breathe faster. You can think about it and affect it. Yeah. That's why it's so cool. But, digestion would just be happening. But if you consciously thought about it, you could, speed up your digestion.

angie 11:03

It would be cool. And there, there are things that are starting to look at those types of things, through indirect lenses of, different types of music that improve digestion or that improve heart rate or those kinds of things. But it's not just a conscious control that you can, like a switch that you can turn on and turn off.

kevin 11:22

I know. It'd just be cool.

angie 11:23

I know. So your breathing then affects your performance. It affects your perceived effort level on your runs. It affects your recovery and your anxiety during hard efforts, during easy runs. It affects everything that you do as a runner, and then especially, things that you do in your daily life, too. Because if you think about it, when you get nervous or when you get anxious in daily life, outside of running, what happens to your breathing? Do you tend to breathe more shallow? Do you tend to breathe more through your chest? That's typically what happens to most people. I would say that I- I've noticed that in myself. like when you get nervous, your- your breathing starts to speed up. It tends to be more in your chest. You don't have those deep diaphragmatic types of breath, breaths. a lot of people, they'll start to hyperventilate when they get nervous or when they start to feel anxiety or panic come on, and they take very deep, rapid, shallow breaths, and that can lead to lightheadedness, and that can lead to all sorts of issues, right? And so controlling our breathing makes a big difference, both in the way that we feel during running, in our performance, and also the way that we feel in our everyday life.

kevin 12:26

Yeah, so we've got several things that could go wrong. Yeah. And some of them, as a coach, I've seen more often than others. Yeah. But there's a bunch of different things that can go wrong. Usually, to me, one of the... there's two things, and one we're, we'll talk about a lot more in depth in a second, is side stitches. Yeah. But the other one is people who just seem out of breath. they're running nice and slow and comfortable. I've I've convinced them that you should just go comfortably. Yeah. And they come back and they're panting. Or they're like, "I just, I can't catch my breath." I'm like, let me see you just run for a little bit." And they're j- just jogging along. But they just, they can't take in any air. And i- that's generally gonna be some sort of, I don't know, dysfunctional breathing. They're usually breathing too shallow. Yeah. they're breathing just, in their throat. I know it's it's chest breathing instead of deep breathing, but they're almost just "I need to get it, get in more air." But in order to just keep inhaling, they're taking these rapid in and out breaths, and it never actually gets to, lungs- so the oxygen can actually get into their bloodstreams. Yeah. They just can't.

angie 13:29

Yeah, so th- getting out of breath is obviously a very visible one. Another one is decreased endurance. You just start wearing out and feeling tired before you feel like you, quote unquote, should. And when that happens, if you don't have a- efficient and efficient, and functional breathing pattern, your respiratory muscles just tend to fatigue because your respiratory mus- muscles, your muscles, your breathing muscles are muscles just like any other muscle, and they have a certain level of endurance, and they tend to fatigue. And that's one of the reasons that you start to feel tired, because all of your muscles, even the muscles that help to control your breathing, need blood and need oxygen. And so as your respiratory muscles fatigue, that redirects the blood away from your working legs because your breathing's more important. your, your- Yep your body knows that it's not gonna make it far without breathing. So those respiratory muscles are gonna take priority over your working legs because your body knows that, oh, you don't have to run this fast. you can slow down your running. You can walk. we can't, not breathe. So we're gonna make sure we prioritize and make sure that those respiratory muscles get enough blood and enough oxygen first.

kevin 14:40

Yeah, 100%. that's, your body will always move towards survival over- Yes running, quote-unquote, "correct pace for this race." Nope. Yeah,

angie 14:48

they don't care.

kevin 14:49

No, if your body's "Nope." Does not

angie 14:50

care.

kevin 14:51

We're gonna live," is actually what we're choosing on this, this one here.

angie 14:54

Yeah.

kevin 14:55

a- another big one is people that just carry themselves super tense- through all their breathing. And this, you gotta be careful as we keep talking about all these different techniques. If you overthink breathing- a lot of people then tend to carry that as tension in their jaw or neck or shoulders. They're trying to hold everything just so perfect- that it just carries all this tension, which then actually just prevents any of the, the movement inside of your ribs where they're supposed to actually go, because all of your muscles are just so tight. And then because the muscles are so tight- you can't take a deep breath, which then makes you feel like you're out of breath, so then you tighten up even more. it's vicious.

angie 15:32

It's a vicious cycle. And then, of course, the, another one would be that you're not as fast as you want because if you don't have a functional, efficient, effective breathing pattern, if it's more random or if it's asymmetric, those breathing patterns can place uneven stress on the body, and so you're not gonna be able to go as fast as you want. I think about a lot of times, what is it? Patting your head and rubbing your stomach, or vice versa. Like, when you're j- doing random things and trying to coordinate things and your body's not coordinated properly, that takes a lot more effort and a lot more energy. Versus when you operate in a symmetrical and coordinated way, then your body can actually use the energy more effectively to help you go faster, versus just trying to keep everything coordinated.

kevin 16:16

Yeah, the asymmetric versus symmetric breathing is an interesting one we're gonna dive into a little bit more later.

angie 16:21

Yeah.

kevin 16:22

But before we get there, it's my favorite topic, side stitches.

angie 16:26

Yes, and we definitely need to go into a little bit more detail, because this is one area that a lot of runners have issues, especially newer runners, or especially runners that are trying to increase their endurance or the length of their run or the speed of their run. We've got cross country season coming up now. We were supposed to have our first practice today, being South Florida in August, we decided to have, thunderstorms and lightning right at the time that we were supposed to have practice, and so we ended up having to cancel unfortunately. But we know that this is one of the big issues that we deal with most of our freshman runners every single year, and some of our returners as well that haven't been running over the summer like they were supposed to. but side stitches- Or been

kevin 17:07

running since last October.

angie 17:09

Yeah, so side stitches are definitely a big issue that a lot of runners deal with, and we want to help you with those. So Kevin, tell me about your side stitches, 'cause this is one of the areas that you really helped me with for sure.

kevin 17:21

so my main exposure to side stitch is when I started running. I was fine at first when I like I went out, I ran with my dad, and we had like this, this path that we went on, and I was fine. And then I started going to cross-country practice with the team, and over the summer that involves running up and down a hill. it's this, it's this- loop, and you have to like essentially climb a big hill and then go down. And I was fine to start, and I was fine going up the hill, and I would always get a side stitch going down. And so then I learned all these various techniques to get rid of a side stitch once I already had it. But ultimately, that's not the goal. The goal is to prevent it from happening in the first place.

angie 17:57

Yeah.

kevin 17:57

And I determined two things. One, I was a new runner. That was the main thing my coach- told me is, "You're a new runner. You just have to the more you run, the stronger the muscles will be- Yeah and everything will be held in place. That's fine." And two, it wasn't until one of the like veteran runners on the team watched me run downhill, and he said, "Oh, you hold your breath on the downhills." Like I literally, I wasn't taking in any oxygen. I was just, I was gasping for air.

angie 18:21

I was- 'Cause you were so nervous, you were probably braced so much.

kevin 18:24

That's right. So I was super tense through the shoulders- Yeah neck and everything, and I would hold my breath until we got to like a slightly less steep part, and then I would like gasp for air, and then hold my breath on the next steep part. It was like the least efficient way that you could breathe as I went down the hill. Yeah. So side stitches non-stop.

angie 18:41

No, and that was- But- Go ahead.

kevin 18:43

So what's actually happening? Because my coach was also right, that the more I ran, the less I got side stitches, 'cause what's, medically, what's going on here?

angie 18:53

so this is the really interesting thing, because you can hear, you hear a lot of things, and one of the biggest things that we hear from people, and a lot of the people don't really know, and so we're just guessing at like what exactly is happening. One of the biggest things that I've heard is that it's a spasm of the diaphragm muscle, right?

kevin 19:11

Yeah, I've heard that.

angie 19:12

have you heard that one? What other things have you heard?

kevin 19:15

that's, that is the one that I've heard enough- Yeah that I have repeated to other people.

angie 19:20

Yeah.

kevin 19:20

Whether it's correct or not, I've heard it enough, and some of the treatments make sense based- off of saying it's a spasm of the diaphragm.

angie 19:28

Yeah.

kevin 19:29

But if you put your hand, like, where your diaphragm is, it doesn't feel like that's what's going on.

angie 19:33

And so this is the interesting part, is that we actually don't fully know. if you actually look at the research on what causes this pain, this sharp, intense, awful pain that we experience, there's different theories on it, because they don't really know exactly what causes it. And so the leading theory, currently the best-supported theory, is that it's... Okay, ready for the big words for it? Yes. The parietal peritoneum irritation. So the p- parietal peritoneum is the lining of the abdominal wall, and so the theory is that the friction between the parietal and the visceral layers of the peritoneum, which is, your abdominal wall there, caused by that repetitive trunk movement during running, spe- es- especially combined with a full stomach, irritates the lining and produces the pain. And that explains why eating close to running tends to provoke it, and also why, certain types of drinks, especially, like, very carbonated drinks, tend to also irritate it more, because they're increasing the volume and the pressure in the gut, which increases the friction there. So that is currently the best-supported theory that we have.

kevin 20:44

Yeah, it's, it is wordy. I, I- Yeah was just pushing to you to say parietal peritoneum, but- I know.

angie 20:50

It's fun like that, right? Some

kevin 20:52

of the- It's weird, because it's it, so it's this, lining that's trying to hold your organs in place, and as you run and jostle- your organs essentially pull down on this thing and cause irritation. So that means that, the more you do it, do you numb the irritation? Do you just get used to the irritation? Are there muscles- yeah, because, look- that help support it better?

angie 21:09

I think it's a combination of all of it, right? I think that it would be a combination of your muscles getting stronger and, supporting it better, and then, like any type of nerve, so pain is a, a nerve signal, right? Like, when we experience pain, we are getting some sort of, irritation somewhere in the body, and that pain signal is being sent to the brain. And with time, our nerves get desensitized, right? if- Yeah so I think maybe that could be happening there. and again, these are just theories, right? So we, again, don't really fully know. Another theory is, visceral ligament stress, which the viscera are your, or, internal organs. And so the liver, side stitches tend to be more on the right because of the liver, because the liver is the biggest organs, and that's hel- suspended from the diaphragm by ligaments. And so that repetitive impact of running, pulls the organs downward while the diaphragm is moving upward, creating stretch stress on those ligaments, which is, that would explain why it's twice as likely to occur on the right side in adults, because the liver is the heaviest organ and hangs on the right side. I know for me, I always get them on my right. I don't know if you remember, since it's been 30 years since you've had one, if you remember what side. But mine was always on my right.

kevin 22:27

Oh, I would get the wraparounds

angie 22:29

Wrap arounds

kevin 22:31

Yeah

angie 22:31

Oh God, that sounds terrible. Mine was like right under my rib, right on the right-hand side.

kevin 22:36

Yeah, no, the fact that it never... I could get it on one side, but sometimes it would stretch to the other. I've, I have- Yeah had them in the past few years, but I get them rarely. And I usually am able to deal with them relatively quickly. Yeah. But I've had some bad ones, and usually it starts whichever side. It, if I don't get rid of it, it will start wrapping all the way around, which is why it makes sense to me- to phrase it as a spasm of the diaphragm- Yeah even if that's not even what's happening- Yeah because that's what it feels like.

angie 23:04

and so that is, the third theory, and right now it is the least supported theory, but that's kind of the old textbook explanation. But based on what they currently have access to, it's, considered the least likely, is that the diaphragm becomes oxygen deprived during hard exercise and produces a cramping type of pain. But they don't think that's really the, the most consistent, or they don't think that's the best explanation of what exactly is happening.

kevin 23:29

All right.

angie 23:30

So- Quote, quote unquote, "They." Yeah, they. Like scientists out there.

kevin 23:33

Yeah. Big,

angie 23:34

big side stitch. so yeah. So the, the best supported theory right now is that it's an irritation of the abdominal lining based on that repetitive movement. So I mean- Regardless of what, you know- Regardless,

kevin 23:47

what do we do?

angie 23:48

What do we do? Yeah, exactly. Because, it's fun to know why things are happening, but ultimately we need to know what to do about it and how to fix it, right? And so Kevin said, side stitches tend to go away with time and experience, and this is what one of the big things we tell our runners. "Sorry, you're just gonna have to figure out how to run through it right now." And this is the other thing that I often tell our runners, too, when, especially when we get new runners. We don't like to run through pain unless it's a side stitch. Because there are certain types of pain. If there is any sort of sharp, shooting type of pain, you guys need to stop running and come talk to me so that I know, unless it's a side stitch. Because there's a sharp, shooting pain right under your rib, makes it hard to breathe, it feels like someone is literally stabbing you with a knife, you can try to keep running through it because there won't be long-term damage done, right? When it's a, a different type of injury, say you get that sharp, shooting pain in a calf muscle and you try to keep running through it, you could do further damage to that muscle. But if you are trying to run through a side stitch, sometimes that's the best way to do it. You just kinda gotta get through it because, especially if you're in a race, right? especially if you're in a race, there's not much that you can do. And so the best way that we can do it is trying to prevent it. and s- and the best ways to prevent it is to make sure that you have space between eating and running. So if, especially if you're a newer runner, you wanna make sure that you're eating, one and a half to two hours before your run, because eating too close to the run can definitely tend to put you at higher risk for a side stitch. if you start off too fast and don't let your body warm up, that's gonna put you at higher risk for a side stitch. If you are doing very shallow chest breathing, that's gonna put you at higher risk. So learning to breathe properly, l- like what we're gonna be talking about later in the episode, that's gonna help you with side stitch. And then also just getting stronger. running more, improving your endurance, and improving your core stability. Because- If you can im- improve the strength in your abdominal muscles and your core and your trunk muscles, they can just help support that area better. And so there's gonna be less jostling, less things, you know, shaking around where we don't want them. And core stability work is going to help kinda more long-term. But Kevin, why don't you tell everybody what to do if you're in the middle of a run and you start to get one of these very mean, painful little things happening, because y- you taught me all of these techniques when I was a new runner.

kevin 26:17

Okay, so you got options. The, the easiest is to walk.

angie 26:22

Yeah.

kevin 26:22

it's not necessarily the most optimal, depending on what it is that you're doing, but if you walk, that pain will subside almost immediately.

angie 26:28

So I would suggest walking if you can. if, obviously if you're in a race you're not gonna want to walk, but walking and then combining that walk with these other techniques that Kevin's gonna tell you about.

kevin 26:39

because some of the techniques work, but they're easier to do if you're walking. Or if you simply slow down and you try and continue to run, but then you try the techniques. Yeah. Okay, so a big one, belly breathing. over-exaggerated, ab... I don't wanna say abdominal breathing, 'cause the study said that was dysfunctional. Yeah. But breathing where you're s- you literally on every breath, you like push your stomach out. So super exaggerated. I wanna take a deep breath, ideally through my nose, and push my stomach out as I do it. that's good- Yeah,

angie 27:08

so diaphragmatic and 360 degree breathing, which we're gonna talk about in the next section. That's g- that's what you're gonna wanna try to do.

kevin 27:14

Yep. And then, w- The one that, that has worked, hit or miss, you can take a finger or two and jam it into the exact spot that you're feeling the excruciating pain.

angie 27:27

Yeah.

kevin 27:28

That one sometimes works. Sometimes doesn't. Yeah. Sometimes just angers it. but sometimes it

angie 27:33

works. It doesn't usually make it worse, though.

kevin 27:35

Sometimes it migrates to the other side. You never know. but that one works. And I try and breathe in and out with my hand in place. So try and get your fingers, deep into exactly where that pain is- Yeah and then take a breath or two. if you can take a, a deeper breath while, whilst jamming your fingers in, that's ideal. And then, the other one is slow exhale through, close your lips like you're trying to blow out a candle. really purse your lips and take a long exhale. Yeah. Beyond just, tighten the lips, I actually like to take my hand and make, a, a soft fist with it. I make a little opening- between, my index finger and thumb, and then I close off on the pinky side, and I blow into that as hard as I possibly can. So it's, it's a forced difficult exhale. That is- Like

angie 28:22

a resisted exhale

kevin 28:24

a resisted exhale. That's my biggest one, and, blowing out through pursed lips is also that. Blowing a raspberry, just like that would, that is- I tell that one to the runners dur- when they're racing- and they get a side stitch, 'cause I try and get them to blow raspberries, 'cause even if you can get them to laugh about how ridiculous it is that they're in a race and blowing raspberries-

angie 28:46

Yeah

kevin 28:46

sometimes the laughter will throw their breathing off enough- that it makes the side stitch go away also. Cause really anything that just, just makes a big switch in your breathing will- Yeah sometimes make a benefit. But the, the good ones are if you can slow your self down and take a good deep belly breath-

angie 29:03

Yeah

kevin 29:03

and then slow exhale through pursed lips.

angie 29:06

Yeah, and like you said, that's one of the things I like to do is I jam my finger right into that side stitch and try to breathe into that spot, breathe into my finger. So I'm almost, like, pointing at, to my body of "This is where I want you to breathe," breathe right into this spot, and that tends to help and make it relax.

kevin 29:24

Yeah, you're big on the jam your fingers in. I'm big on the blow into a fist. Y- but honestly, you find the way that has worked for you before, and then you've convinced yourself, "This is my trick for getting rid of side stitches."

angie 29:34

Yep.

kevin 29:34

I think it's like hiccups. Everybody's got a method for getting rid of hiccups that they're convinced- works the best for them.

angie 29:39

Yeah.

kevin 29:40

And it may, but part of it might be because you've convinced yourself that's the one that works for you.

angie 29:44

No, you hold your breath and put your chin to your chest, and hold it as long as you can.

kevin 29:48

Yeah, You drink from the opposite side of a cup.

angie 29:51

Do you do

kevin 29:52

that? That's how you get rid of hiccups.

angie 29:54

I've not seen you do that.

kevin 29:56

I'm not sure the last time I had hiccups.

angie 29:57

That's true. I had them yesterday 'cause I, drank some... I took a drink out of my Stanley through my straw, and it just, hit the back of my throat weird. Remember? I came out and I'm, like, coughing. You're like, "Are you okay?"

kevin 30:10

You

angie 30:10

were choking on

kevin 30:11

water.

angie 30:11

I was coughing. I was hiccupping. I just s- my eyes were watering, all sorts of weird stuff. All right, so let's talk about what is a functional breathing pattern.

kevin 30:21

Yes.

angie 30:21

So this is the, one of the things that... The study that we referred to, talked about diaphragmatic breathing. You've probably heard this term. Most people are actually doing diaphragmatic re- breathing wrong. They think that they're diaphragmatic breathing, but they're, according to that study, doing more of, an abdominal breathing, where they allow their belly to expand, but then also their chest and shoulders rise. Because true diaphragmatic breathing, your chest and your shoulders stay relaxed, stay quiet, and you get an expansion of the diaphragm in 360 degrees. Because your diaphragm is a 360-degree muscle. It is a dome-shaped muscle that sits right underneath your lungs and above all of your abdominal internal organs. And it stretches the full length of your trunk. And so this muscle is your primary breathing muscle, and most people are underusing it. Most people breathe more through their chest, and so they are not oxygenating fully, not just in running, but just in regular life. Most people are using chest-dominant breathing, which is less efficient, it's more fatiguing, and it also creates that chronic upper body tension that you were talking about too, Kevin, like the tension in your chest, in your shoulders, in your jawline, in your neck. And it just makes the whole area tense because of the way that you're breathing, and the diaphragm is not able to fully expand, able to fully get in that air, and relax the body also. that's the big thing, too, is that there's that direct line to our autonomic nervous system through our vagus nerve, and if we're not utilizing that pr- properly, we're just getting more of that, tightening and tension in the body.

kevin 31:55

the key on diaphragmatic breathing that I really is when you're able to take a deep breath and air gets into the lower part of your lungs, not just the top part, but the lower part-

angie 32:04

That's the part you really like?

kevin 32:05

I think this one's fascinating- Yeah is you actually, like there's greater blood supply at the bottom of your lungs than there is at the top. So if you can take a deep breath, then the oxygen that's coming into your lungs will then actually have greater chance of passing into the bloodstream. Which is ultimately the point. in terms of exercise, you wanna get oxygen into the bloodstream so that you can then use that and run faster. It's actually not why we breathe. We breathe so we don't poison ourself with carbon dioxide. But in terms of running, we wanna get oxygen into the working muscles, and taking a deep breath is going to get more oxygen into the bloodstream- because you have greater blood supply at the bottom of your lungs. Which, super cool.

angie 32:48

It is super cool, and most people don't really realize that. And you wanna get down into those deeper lungs, and they've actually done some crazy studies showing years, like year- people that have been chronic chest breathers and how much they don't utilize their lungs, and the way that those, the lungs, like the lower lobes of the lungs atrophy over time, you know, with age and lack of use. It's really interesting. So to take it one step further, diaphragmatic breathing has also been called 360-degree breathing because a lot of people think, "Oh, diaphragmatic breathing means belly breathing." They think about abdominal expansion in a forward direction, which is good. That's a good place to start. But like I said, your diaphragm goes all the way around your body inside your thoracic abdominal cavity. And so we really wanna be expanding in all directions. We want our ribs to expand to the front, to the sides, and to the back. thinking about breathing into your back. Have you ever done that?

kevin 33:48

Me?

angie 33:48

Yeah.

kevin 33:49

No, I've never thought about breathing into my back.

angie 33:52

Do it right

kevin 33:53

now. I have tho- okay, I did think about breathing into my back, 20 minutes ago when I read through the outline for this podcast.

angie 34:00

There you go.

kevin 34:01

when I did, when I learned diaphragmatic breathing, I was taught to first... I did it while laying down and put my hand on my stomach and try and get my hand to rise and fall.

angie 34:15

Yes.

kevin 34:15

And then once you do that, the, the teacher then said, "Okay, now move your hands to your sides. Keep them on your ribs," not just, casually at your side, but keep them on the si- on your sides still touching ribs. Yep. "And now do that same deep breath and see if after your stomach goes up, you then push your hands out." I never made it to the third part of can you feel your body actually pushing down into the floor? But that, that is your full 360. Is your stomach rising? Are your ribs pushing outward? Yep. And do you feel actually like you're pushing down into the ground? And I can definitely make myself do it. It's w- it's super cool, and it feels amazing. it feels- It feels amazing,

angie 34:56

right? Doesn't it also help to relieve, some of the tension in your lower back, too?

kevin 35:01

n- no

angie 35:03

If you did it enough, maybe

kevin 35:05

If I did it enough, if I laid down and did it Yeah I was trying to do it while standing or sitting in a chair and see if I could actually feel like I was pushing against the back of the chair.

angie 35:13

Yeah But

kevin 35:13

it did actually slightly alleviate the, mild background headache that I've got because- Oh, there you

angie 35:18

go

kevin 35:19

today was day one back at school, so- Yeah,

angie 35:20

because you actually

kevin 35:21

got some- I came home with a mild headache

angie 35:22

You got some oxygen up to that brain of yours.

kevin 35:24

There you go

angie 35:25

So when we are able to do that full 360 degree breathing and that expansion, that helps to create that intra-abdominal pressure, okay? Because what is happening is your... if you ever have heard from or learned from or seen some videos on Instagram about core stability or pelvic floor, basically your diaphragm is the top, and i- a lot of experts, they describe your abdominal cavity as a can. And the diaphragm is the top of the can, and your pelvic floor is the bottom of the can. And the goal is to create pressure in your abdominal cavity, but regulated by your diaphragm and your pelvic floor. Because a lot of times people will think about trying to tighten their pelvic floor and doing Kegel exercises and those kinds of things, but they don't think about their diaphragm. And all of it has to work as a system. And so that intra-abdominal pressure helps to create that core stability system that helps to protect your spine and your internal organs during running. So it's really a cool thing that you can start to do that most people haven't even thought about. But when you create that bracing system and start to fully use your diaphragm, then you're also m- very likely going to help improve the strength and the function of your pelvic floor muscles as well. S- And then get, getting them to coordinate and work together, which we're not talking about in today's ex- today's episode, is another way to really help to improve the stability of your core

kevin 36:54

Yeah, so when we're talking about improving your core in this one, it's a lot less... it is, you can do planks, like that's gonna improve your core.

angie 37:01

Yeah.

kevin 37:01

But literally just

angie 37:03

planks- Yeah, but planks while you're thinking about your breathing is even better.

kevin 37:06

Yes.

angie 37:07

Like this is the cool thing about breathing, is that it can literally improve everything you do. if you just focus on your breathing with your strength training exercises, you will drastically improve the effectiveness of those exercises. I was actually doing this today with my mom, talking about the pelvic floor and the breathing exercises. So one of the exercises that I was doing today in my strength session was bridge abduction f- while focusing on my breath. And so I would, I had a, a resistance band around my knees, and I bridged up, and then I separated my knees, pulling against that band. And as I abducted my legs and pulled against the band, stretched the band out, I focus on fully exhaling. And with that full exhale, I really focus on activating the muscles in my lower abdominal region. So my lower ab muscles with that full exhale, and then inhaling as the legs came back together. Exhaling as they, I push them apart, inhaling as they come back together. And just that focus on the breath and that like core lower abdominal activation made the exercise s- harder and so much more effective.

kevin 38:17

Yeah, because then you can turn almost any exercise that you're doing, strength training, into abdominal work also. if you ju- as you do the- seems efficient.

angie 38:28

Seems like a good idea

kevin 38:29

it's the same as you can improve your breathing as you're running. If you're gonna head out for an hour-long run, you don't want to think about it for an hour of your run. That's gonna drive you nuts. True. So sure, you could put breathing into your strength training from time to time. I wouldn't necessarily go over the top and think about it all the time.

angie 38:51

No, and we're gonna talk about that later in the episode of, like, how to actually incorporate all of this.

kevin 38:55

Yeah, 100%. But I also, I really like to put breathing into, mobility exercises- Yes 'cause I think that's,

angie 39:01

that is super helpful. Mobility. Yeah, breathing makes mobility exercises way more effective. Part of that is because you are then utilizing the parasympathetic nervous system to actually help your body relax, help the muscles stop being defensive, 'cause a lot of times when we try to do mobility exercises, your body tenses up to try to protect you, and using that slow control diaphragmatic breathing, again, helps to relax the nervous system, helps to relax that muscle tension, and make those mobility exercises more effective.

kevin 39:31

Excellent. All right. Let's move ourselves along and come to another, oh, I'm gonna say controversial breathing topic.

angie 39:37

Yes, it's definitely one of the big questions that we get pretty much every year from somebody, from one of our runners.

kevin 39:43

Yeah. I've got a take on it, but we'll discuss.

angie 39:45

Nose, nose breathing versus mouth breathi- breathing, Kevin. What is your take?

kevin 39:50

Breathe

angie 39:53

Yeah. this is definitely one of those circumstances where I think people overcomplicate it. I think that this is one of those areas where there is a, quote unquote, "ideal way to breathe," and we're gonna give you some of the reasons for that. But ultimately, you need to get air in, and that pattern is going to change based on the intensity that you're running as well, and that's okay.

kevin 40:15

That, that pattern may also change based off of the anatomy of your nose.

angie 40:18

Yes, very true.

kevin 40:20

So-

angie 40:20

there's nothing wrong with you if you can't nose breathe while you're running

kevin 40:23

100%. So yeah, is it better to breathe through your nose? if you're easy running, you should be able to breathe through your nose. It's great. It filters the air, warms the air, humidifies the air. Everything about nose breathing is fantastic. There's a reason why, you can probably go online and buy, $100 mouth tape that people sleep now- where they look like hostages. It's terrible. Like, why, like, why is that a, $100? That's ridiculous. But there are some benefits to nose breathing. But if you go out for a run and you're like, "As soon as I go above a walk, I have to breathe through my mouth"- Yeah that's okay. Maybe you're just perpetually a little bit congested. Maybe the way that your nose works, it's just a little bit tighter vessels than it is in other people. There is nothing wrong if you have to breathe through your mouth. So it's fine. That's my general take. Is nasal breathing better? Sure. Yeah. The kids on our cross-country team that try and race a 5K breathing through their nose make me want to tear my hair out.

angie 41:25

I know. We had to have that conversation with one of our young runners last year, and it w- she was very upset because she couldn't breathe through her nose, and we told her, "Just breathe," and it just relieved so much pressure. She was putting so much pressure on herself. She thought she was doing it wrong. And so- if

kevin 41:42

you can figure out how to breathe through your ears also, whatever you can get, air in- Get the

angie 41:47

air in, yeah

kevin 41:48

do it.

angie 41:49

Yeah. Yes, and so- Is nose breathing better than mouth breathi- breathing? In theory, there are more benefits because of the things that Kevin said, right? It filters the air, it warms the air, it humidifies the air, it produces nitric ox- oxide, which is a vasodilator. That means your blood vessels get wider, and that improves blood flow. But there's a lot

kevin 42:11

of- You can just buy the expensive supplement. It, you can now take pills that are nitric dioxide Yeah.

angie 42:15

But, there's people out there, maybe you used to play hockey when you were younger, and you broke your na- nose a bunch of times, and you're, you have a deviated septum. that's not gonna work for you, and that's okay. So we are here to say, is it a good thing to practice? Sure. if you wanna practice breathing through your nose and seeing if you can make that work, start with your easy runs and see if you can breathe for a couple of minutes through your nose, and then go back to breathing however you normally breathe. you can practice this. You don't have to just decide either I, I'm mou- a mouth breather or a nose breather. you can combine both nose, no- nose breathing and mouth breathing during your run and probably get good results. And this is going to change based on your effort level. I know that, for the most part, I'm a nose breather when I'm running at an easy pace, but when I'm running at higher intensity or if I'm talking during a run, I tend to breathe through my mouth also. I do both, and that's okay.

kevin 43:08

Yeah. I just always breathe through my mouth

angie 43:11

Yeah? Always?

kevin 43:11

O- yeah. O- over time, I think I figured out how to, at, at much faster paces- Yeah effectively breathe through my mouth and nose simultaneously. Which I thought I was doing at first, but it turned out once I opened my mouth, I was just breathing through my mouth.

angie 43:26

Yeah.

kevin 43:26

But I think I've actually figured out how to take in air through both- and just get more air in. But yeah, I- Well- almost as easy as I'm running, my mouth is still open. It's not, gaped, but I open my mouth so I can breathe.

angie 43:38

A gape?

kevin 43:39

Yes, a gape.

angie 43:41

All right. Let's talk about exercises that you can do to actually improve your breathing, okay?

kevin 43:47

Yes, please.

angie 43:48

Now, oh, okay, great. Now, this applies, we're gonna start off with breathing exercises when you're not running, because we highly recommend that you actually practice these things when you're not out there running, and you're gonna move from off the run and then gradually add it into your run, and we're gonna teach you guys, or we're gonna recommend ways that you can do that. So the first technique that you wanna learn is diaphragmatic breathing. It's true diaphragmatic breathing. And so for a lot of people, the easiest way is, to do this is, like what Kevin had mentioned earlier, is starting off on your back. If you wanna start sitting, that's fine, too. I usually have one person, or I usually have people place one hand on their chest. If you guys are watching us on YouTube, because you guys know we have video podcasting now, we are on YouTube, so if you're watching on YouTube, you can s- see me demonstrate this. I have one person put... not one person. I have the person put one hand on their chest and one hand on their belly. Kevin is showing it better than I ha- I am, because you can't see my belly with the way that my camera is currently set up. So yeah, Kevin, just, scoot back a little bit. I'll just instruct you. There we go. Perfect. Oh, now he's standing up. Perfect. So one hand on the chest, one hand on the belly. If you are lying on your back, you can have your knees bent, 'cause a lot of times that helps to keep the body more relaxed. It helps keep the back pressed into the mat. What you're gonna do is you're going to inhale for four counts through your nose, preferably, but if you wanna use your mouth, you can do that, too. And the goal is to get your belly to expand, so you want the hand on your belly to rise, and you want the hand on your chest to stay still. So you wanna try to expand your belly without moving, without the hand on your chest moving. So you're gonna inhale for four counts, and you're gonna try to exhale for six counts. So this- When you- Go ahead.

kevin 45:39

When you first start, I- don't even worry about counting. No. See if you can... if you are a significant chest breather- Yeah see if you can make the hand on your belly rise. Cause, when I got into this, I couldn't. Yeah. I could not make that go up. I didn't even try and get into this through running. I really think that the main time that I started figuring out how to breathe better was my senior year in high school, where I took a meditation class.

angie 46:02

Okay. Yeah.

kevin 46:03

And we learned various breathing techniques.

angie 46:05

Yes, and this is a fantastic technique that you will learn in meditation or in yoga. Diaphragmatic breathing is very important, and so that's one of the reasons that I like people, I like you to put your hand on your chest and on your belly, because then the goal is for you to breathe into the hand, right? it, you're giving yourself essentially a target. It's called biofeedback. You're... And so one of the things, like if you are finding it difficult to expand your belly when you breathe, I would suggest that when you, as you exhale, you're going to keep that, that hand that's on your belly, exhale all the air out, and then give a slight push right before you inhale. So you're giving this, little nudge of, this is where I want you to expand, and this is one of the, the techniques that I use with my patients, is, I give them that manual, just a little jolt to help the belly understand where it's supposed to go and where it's supposed to expand.

kevin 46:57

Excellent. This is, it's a great technique.

angie 47:00

Yeah. Y-

kevin 47:00

you suggest you can do this heading to sleep, 'cause it's a good one-

angie 47:03

as you're laying, as you're laying down for bed. Yes, it's a great... Yeah, so do it five minutes before bed or five minutes after your run, and it will just totally help to calm your nervous system. from diaphragmatic breathing, you can do it lying down, then you should do it sitting up, then standing, then walking, then running. So that's how you would progress this technique is, learning how to do it in those slow, still positions first, and then practice while you're actually moving around, while you're cooking dinner, moving around the kitchen, practice breathing into your diaphragm. From there, you can move on to the 360-degree breathing. So you're gonna put your hands on your side, on your lower ribs. Kev, you wanna show the video, our video viewers exactly where we're putting that, those r- hands? Yeah. So we're putting our hands right on the lower ribs there, and the goal is to focus on pushing your ribs outward as you inhale. So you inhale, and you're focusing on pushing those ribs outward and feeling the expansion of your ribcage in a lateral manner, side to side manner. Got it?

kevin 48:05

Yep.

angie 48:06

All right. Same thing. If you are having a hard time with it, as you exhale, you're gonna let the hands kind of exhale in, and then just put, push a little bit of pressure as you start to inhale, and that will often help get the, the, those side to side breath, happening. And

kevin 48:21

just like diaphragmatic and 360 are very much connected.

angie 48:24

Yes.

kevin 48:25

So start on your back, move to sitting, move to standing- slowly progress.

angie 48:29

And then we've got some other practice drills that you can do. Okay, so that's the technique. The technique is actually the diaphragmatic breathing and the 360 degree breathing. So that's what you're going to really wanna focus in and practice on. Now we have some other ideas that you can use, and these are breathing drills that people use, and you've probably heard of some of these. And this is just really good for nervous system relaxation, for helping to increase the depth of your breathing and there's been a lot of really good research on a, a lot of these techniques as well. the first one is box breathing. This was, I, and I don't want to know if it was first developed in the Army, but the, the military definitely uses bro- box breathing and teaches this to the soldiers. Basically, you just imagine that you are drawing a box. So you inhale for four seconds, you hold for four seconds, you exhale for four seconds, and then you hold for four seconds. Okay, so you're going four seconds up, down, up, side, down, and back to the front. and there's been research that have shown that it's improved cardiovascular recovery, it's good for relaxation, it helps with your nervous system. So you can use box breathing for pre-run, you can use it post-run, you can help it to calm your pre-race nerves, you can help it while you're s- you can use it to help you while you're sitting in terrible traffic. there's all sorts of good use for box breathing.

kevin 49:49

Yeah. Box breathing is, the next step once you actually know that you're breathing right. I don't think it's great. You can box breathe to try and calm yourself down while you're still chest breathing, but it works better-

angie 49:59

Much better

kevin 50:00

just to be able to h- inhale four- Yeah and then hold, and exhale and then hold, if you're actually breathing deeply. and then as you get better at it, you're gonna have to slow the rate of your counting. Cause otherwise, it, instead of inhale four, it's gonna be like inhale six- Yeah and then it's fine. Just count slower. The next- the next one that you got is a good one. The four, seven, eight breathing- where you inhale for four, hold for seven, and then exhale for eight. And then you can move back to inhaling. it's a triangle. It's, it's a scalene triangle instead of a square.

angie 50:32

Thank you, geometry teacher.

kevin 50:34

You are welcome. I'm ready to go. almost any time you exhale more than you inhale, it's going to help your body relax. It, the longer exhale versus inhale activates your parasympathetic nervous system-

angie 50:47

Yeah

kevin 50:47

and this is a great example of it.

angie 50:50

Yep. Another technique is called the physiological sigh, and this is an interesting one, because this has been shown For acute stress reduction. So this, people will often teach this to help reduce, anxiety attacks, panic attacks, that acute stress. the physiological sigh is basically taking a double inhale through your nose. So you breathe in, and then you sniff in again, and then a long, slow exhale through your mouth. Okay? So it's like you breathe in, and then you do one more breath, and then... I- I don't know if you guys can hear me on the recording as I did that, 'cause sometimes Zoom has a really good audio filter. so long, deep breath in, and then that extra sniff in, and then a, a long, slow exhale through the mouth. So that's really great for any sort of panic, if you're starting to panic during your run, if you're having some starting line anxiety, or any moment that you need that, immediate reset, that's a really good technique.

kevin 51:47

Yeah, this one's good for immediate anxiety. the next one is a pursed lip exhale, which honestly is a good practice for if you get a side stitch during a run.

angie 51:56

Yeah.

kevin 51:56

Because what you're doing is inhaling normally, and then making your mouth pretty small, and then slowly breathing out through your mouth. Yeah. So this one, you're doing this mouth breathing. You can breathe in with your nose, and then slowly breathe out through pursed lips. You can breathe in with your mouth if you want, but the key here is pursed lips on the exhale.

angie 52:14

Yeah. So we would highly recommend that you guys try this out when you're not running first. Again, the progression is from lying down to sitting to standing to walking and moving around to running. Now, what do you actually do when you're running? So the number one key is to not change everything at once. It's not "Okay, today I'm gonna go out and I'm gonna nose breathe through this entire run, and I'm gonna use my diaphragm the whole time." that is not going to go well. That's going to take your easy run and make it not easy anymore, right? So-

kevin 52:44

Gonna make it anxious.

angie 52:45

It's gonna make it very anxious. It's gonna make it so much concentration to be involved in that. So- The first week or so that you want to do this, I would suggest just observing what you currently do. Just go out as you run and pay attention to your breathing. do you tend to breathe faster or slower? Do you tend to breathe more through your chest or through your belly, through your nose or through your mouth? Just being an observer and bringing awareness and attention to that is going to be a huge help just to see where you currently are, and then we're gonna start to pick one thing at a time that we want to address.

kevin 53:20

So after a couple weeks where you've started to observe your breathing, and honestly, bring some music with you. Bring our podcast with you- Yeah if you're doing this on a run because otherwise you're gonna spend the entire run continuously checking in on your breathing. Check in and then tune out- and then check back in and be like- Yeah "Did my breathing change? I'm 15 minutes into the run. Now what happens? Oh, I normally get a side stitch after 30 minutes." Check in at that point and see what's happening to your breathing from the beginning to the end. Don't just concentrate on your breath the entire time. No. You'll drive yourself nuts. Okay?

angie 53:52

That would be terrible. But

kevin 53:54

after a couple weeks, the thing that we would suggest to start with is try nasal breathing- at the beginning of an easy run, like maybe the opening 10 minutes, and see how that goes. And if it's feeling great, you can expand, but call that the goal. We're going to just try and breathe through my nose for about 10 minutes and see how it feels.

angie 54:12

Or try to do more diaphragmatic breathing. try to get that belly to expand more. Try to get, if you notice that you are doing a lot of chest breathing, try to get out of your chest and allow your belly and your ribcage to expand more on your run. But just pick one thing. That's really the goal, and don't focus on that thing throughout the entire run. Focus on it for a couple of minutes. If you're listening to music, do it for one song and then go back to the normal way that you breathe. And the more that you do this, as you continue to practice this, you'll just find that your body's gonna start to naturally fall into those patterns, but it takes time to... If you've been chest breathing and mouth breathing for 20 years, don't think that with, a couple of runs, you're gonna suddenly be a no- a nasal diaphragmatic breather. It's gonna take some time and practice because, again, it's an automatic involuntary reaction. Like breath- you, a lot of people just breathe without even thinking about it. So now you're starting to bring some conscious control to it, which is great. It's just gonna take some time to practice. So diaphragmatic breathing would be one of the first things to bring in. The other thing that I really like And Kevin taught me this when I was a new runner and I was like n- did not have my breathing under control at all, is a technique called rhythmic breathing. And- You

kevin 55:25

love this one.

angie 55:26

Oh, I love this one. Did y- did you ever do this one? you're the one that taught it to me originally.

kevin 55:31

Yeah, I briefly did this. But- Drove myself nuts when you

angie 55:34

were, like, really young, right?

kevin 55:35

Yes. Drove myself nuts and stopped doing it. I feel like my dad may have taught me this one. Yeah. He may have picked this one up by, from somebody at the gym- 'cause I was complaining about side stitches, so he probably figured something out and passed it on to me. I was not a fan of it, because it just took too much focus. Yeah. And then eventually I just strengthened the muscles in my abs and- and improved diaphragmatic breathing and don't really get as much side stitches. Yeah. You like this one. You also like to do this one even if you don't have side stitches, though.

angie 56:07

I don't do it anymore. sometimes I do. sometimes I just check in with myself and see where I am, but it's not like I'm focused on it a, a lot anymore. But it, as a new runner, it was something that really helped me. And so bas- basically, the idea is that you keep a steady rhythm with your inhale and your exhale throughout the course of your run. So what Kevin taught me was a four-four breathing pattern. So inhaling for four steps and exhaling for four steps. And if that seems too difficult, then you do three. So inhale for three, exhale for three. There's some research that says a three-two rhythmic pattern is best, where you inhale left, left, and you exhale right, left. So there's lots of different ways that you can do this, but using some sort of rhythm and pattern so that you have a consistent inhale and exhale ratio can be very helpful for a lot of runners.

kevin 56:59

It helps, I think earlier runners, especially if you're getting into the habit of, perpetually getting side stitches. I think that the rhythm helps. I think that if you can figure out how to get a pattern that your inhale and exhale adds up to an odd number- so that with every step you're not always starting your exhale when your left foot hits the ground- Right or always when your right foot hits the ground, I think that would help.

angie 57:27

Yeah.

kevin 57:27

Especially newer runners. Once, i- if you're not suffering from side stitches, this is not a thing to worry about in my opinion. I think that the rhythmic breathing, regardless, three threes, four fours, three twos, whatever your pattern that works for you, is a good one. It's a just nice rhythmic breathing. I think that it helps running become very meditative. You can just kind of- Yeah lose yourself in the flow. I've done it so much that I can now just lose myself in the flow. This is like people that they get into meditation. At first they need a nice guided meditation to help take them, and eventually you just breathe for a little bit and you've really- Oh found a peaceful place.

angie 58:04

Yeah.

kevin 58:05

Yeah, I agree. I think the same thing applies with running.

angie 58:07

Yeah. I definitely agree. So again, these techniques are not for everyone, but if they're gonna be helpful, try them out and see. see what you think. so those are suggestions for breathing during running as well, and ultimately the biggest thing that we want you guys to take away from this episode is that breathing is something that you can control, and it's something that you can train. And your diaphragm is a muscle that you can train like any other muscle in the body. And so doing some diaphragmatic training while you're not running, just like you strength train when you're not running, right? Doing calf raises to strengthen your calf muscles so that you don't get calf cramps or an Achilles issues is important, and so is doing diaphragmatic 360 degree breathing to help train your diaphragm to be stronger and to bring that oxygen down into the lower lobes of your lungs so that you can get more oxygen in, get to the working muscles. There's so many benefits. And you're also gonna feel a lot more relaxed and more calm because you're gonna be breathing deeper, and that's gonna be good for every area of your life as well.

kevin 59:10

Yeah. And it's easier than strength training. You don't have to get into exercise gear. You can literally do this while laying in bed.

angie 59:16

While laying in bed. So that is the challenge that we put out there for you guys today and this week. Spend five minutes when you get into bed tonight and just focus on your breathing. Put one hand on your chest and one hand on your belly, and really make that belly expand. And I'm guessing that a lot of you that might find it difficult to fall asleep are gonna be asleep before you know it, and that your sleep might be more restful. And there might, y- you might find, will likely find so many additional benefits in your life from all of these breathing techniques. So- Go train your diaphragm. Use that breathing muscle. use your breath to support you, both in your running and outside of your running, and see what happens. Any other things you wanna add, Kev?

kevin 1:00:00

No, I think we've covered every possible angle of breathing.

angie 1:00:03

Wrapping it up. All right, guys. If you found this episode helpful, please leave us a review, share it with a friend. support the podcast in some way. we produce this pod- podcast for you guys every single week for free. If you wanna support the podcast, if you wanna donate to the podcast, you can go to realliferunners.com/podcast and you can make a donation there. but you can do just as much by just sharing and leaving a review and helping to, us to spread the word and get this podcast out to more people. As always, thanks for spending this time with us. This has been the Real Life Runners podcast, episode number 473. Now get out there and run your life.