465: Carbs, Creatine, and Caffeine — What the Research Actually Says

With so many supplements marketed to runners, it's easy to wonder what's actually worth taking. In this episode, we cut through the noise and focus on a few supplements that have strong research behind them—while emphasizing that no supplement can replace consistent training, good nutrition, quality sleep, and proper recovery.

We break down the Three Cs: Carbohydrates, Creatine, and Caffeine.

First, we discuss why many runners are underfueling and how carbohydrates play a critical role in performance, recovery, and endurance. Next, we explore creatine monohydrate, one of the most researched supplements available, and its benefits for strength, recovery, and overall health. Finally, we cover caffeine, including how it can improve performance, common dosing guidelines, and why personal tolerance matters.

We also briefly touch on vitamin D, magnesium, omega-3s, and collagen, and discuss when they may be worth considering.

In This Episode:

• Why supplements should never replace the fundamentals
• How carbohydrates support performance and recovery
• The benefits of creatine for runners
• How caffeine can enhance endurance
• When other supplements may be helpful
• Avoiding the optimization trap and keeping things simple

03:53 The Three Cs 

09:59 Fueling During Runs

14:29 Carb Targets And Gut Training

20:16 Women Over 40 And Carbs

25:03 Adjusting Fuel To Effort

28:31 Creatine Explained

41:14 Monohydrate and Daily Dose

43:25 Caffeine Performance Basics

46:23 Dosing and GI Timing

47:33 Metabolism and Jitters

50:29 Sleep and Tolerance Tradeoffs

54:12 Race Day Caffeine Rules

56:54 Vitamin D Testing

59:34 Magnesium for Cramps

01:03:38 Omega 3 Benefits

01:05:26 Collagen Versus Protein

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Transcript

0:00

Welcome back to the Real Life Runners podcast, episode number 465. Last week we talked about the optimization trap, which is the way that our culture has built an entire industry around the idea that you can buy your way to a better body. And we basically made the case that your foundation always comes first, that no supplement, device, or protocol can do what consistent training, adequate sleep, real nutrition, and recovery are supposed to do. And after that episode, we knew that we needed to follow it up with this one because the honest next question is, okay, once my foundation is solid, are there any supplements that actually have enough research behind them to be worth a serious conversation? And the answer is yes, a small number of them. So that's what we're gonna be talking about today. Stay tuned What's up, runners? Welcome back to the show. Today we're gonna be talking about the supplements that actually have some decent research behind them, and we're gonna talk about what the research actually shows, what it doesn't show, and what the limitations are. Because as this is not a commercial. This is a free podcast. There are no ads. There are no affiliate links. Actually, before, af- just in case you do find something that you like in today's episode, you can head over to realiferunners.com, just kidding, to find the link to buy it. Nope, just kidding. That isn't actually the thing. We are just here with information. We're not here to make you buy things. We're not here to make you definitely not spend money on things that you don't need that doesn't actually do anything, and it's definitely not a blanket recommendation either. You guys know we try to avoid blanket recommendations. This is just us trying to give you the most honest picture we can so that you can make your own informed decision. you took my joke. I was gonna say, and now that you've covered that, here are the list of 40 supplements we have. Please check the show notes for our link. Please download the PDF in the show notes- Oh and use the link in the PDF to make sure that you, when you purchase them, you use it through that link. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, excellent. and that's honestly- Little aside, that's one, one of the reasons that we don't have any sort of affiliate links that we promote on this podcast, because we want you all to know that this is all coming from us and from science and from evidence and our own experience that we've had with, ourselves and all of the athletes that we've worked with without any sort of financial bias here. Right, which is really what you're gonna get through this episode is- Yeah these are supplements that, that we use- that we've seen other people use- Yep and that science actually has some evidence behind. Exactly. And we're gonna sh- tell you about the limitations of that evidence as well. yeah, that too. And yes, we do have a coaching program available as well, and I will continue to tell you guys about that on all of our podcast episodes, because while we're not here to support you spending your money or investing in things that are not worth your time, when you invest in coaching, it can open up a whole new level in your running, and that we do have available. And so if you are someone that wants help to build a strong foundation, not to be sold the latest supplement, but to actually build a strong foundation, you can head over to realliferunners.com/team and figure out if our team and our membership is a right fit for you if you want some coaching to help you with your running. Because quite honestly, we all have shortcomings, including us, And a lot of times a coach in a program can help you address some of those things. Yeah. that's very true. Having a PT in your back pocket is remarkably helpful as- Yeah as I have found today. Because as a runner, things are going to come up, right? That's just part of this. And so you guys know that we have this coaching program. We're not hiding anything from you, and we're here to help you. So with all of that said, today we're gonna be covering what are- we are calling the three Cs. It's fun how it worked out that way when we were researching this, episode and we were deciding what we wanted to talk about today. Today we're talking about the three Cs, which are carbohydrates, creatine, and caffeine, and we're gonna be talking about the research that we have behind all of them because these are all actually well, very well-researched supplements that all can benefit you, again, if you have a solid foundation in place. So before we jump into anything, please always re- remember, go back to episode 464. We talk about, the optimizer trap and the importance of having a strong foundation. really, that's what this entire podcast and the past 465 episodes are really all about is making sure that you have a solid foundation. So keep that in mind, that this episode is to be used after you have that strong foundation as a way to help improve how you feel. And quite honestly, the s- first thing that we're gonna be talking about here- can help even if you do have some minor ho- minor holes in your foundation. I think that this person- 'Cause this is a hole. This is part of the foundation, right? The person almost is a hole in your foundation. Yeah. And, it's not really exactly a supplement. It's, it's carbohydrates. It's making sure that you are providing your body with enough fuel- for it to do whatever activity it is that you want it to do. So carbohydrates are not a supplement in the traditional sense. Like, when we talk about supplements, we often talk about vitamins or minerals or things that you take that are supposed to, quote-unquote, "supplement" your diet. But carbohydrates should be a s- structural and integral part of your healthy diet as a runner. But we, today we wanna talk about how they are also the most evidence-supported performance nutrient for endurance athletes, and most recreational runners are chronically underusing them. And so before we talk about any other supplement, we have to talk about carbohydrates. Because if... I... We can tell you about s- some of the other things that we're gonna talk about. We're gonna talk about creatine and caffeine, and we're gonna... If we have time, we're gonna get into some other things like magnesium, vitamin D. It just depends on the length of the episode, and if we don't get into those things today, then we will do them on a future episode. But if you're not getting enough carbs, then your body doesn't have the fuel that it needs, and so no other supplementation that you use is going to be as effective for you as if you were to actually take in the proper amount of carbohydrates for your body. Yeah. And this is on an all-day-long and a day-to-day thing and a during the run thing. So there's research on both sides. There's if you are actually just underfilled all day long, underfueled all day long, your body lowers its metabolism 'cause it tries to, it essentially recognizes, "Oh, wait, there's not enough fuel in me." "I can't burn as much fuel." And it will start shutting down various body functions so that it can just maintain its baseline. Yeah. And then it essentially happens on, overdrive when you're exercising, and now your body, needs to be using... 'Cause carbs are the easiest, most efficient way of creating fuel inside of your body, essentially. Yeah. Your body's preferred source of fuel. You- Especially as an endurance athlete. You got fat on your body, and there are people out there that'll tell you, "Oh, there's enough fat on your body that you could fuel yourself for days upon days." And that's true. It's just remarkably slow-burning. So as an endurance athlete, as someone who's going out and trying to run, if you're trying to fuel it entirely based off of the fat burning inside of your body, it's gonna be slow-going. You've actually tried this yourself where you did a personal experiment and tried to see- I did how you could actually train- if you could maintain your normal training once you fat adapted and were a keto athlete, and just trying to see how your body performed to go out while you were taking in very minimal carbohydrates. Yeah, I didn't feel good. I- that was years ago at this point. That was probably back in 2017 when fat ada- adaptation and keto and all that started to really come to the forefront. That's crazy that's almost 10 years ago at this point. Th- that was a while ago. That is nuts. But yes, I did go on a more ketogenic diet. I did, do that for at least a month. Let's see. I wanna say it was like... It was like longer than that though. I think it was a couple of months that I was following a protocol, and I did lose weight on it, but I did not feel good on my runs. I did not feel like I had any energy on any of my runs. I remember that you kinda stopped running for a little while- Yeah because it, it- 'cause that was like the protocol. That was part of the plan. Yeah, the part of the pr- protocol was to reduce inflammation and all of that stuff, and so I did take a short break from running, and it wasn't very long, but yes. Yeah, and then you tried to get back up, and your first run was just miserable- Terrible because you didn't- But like it- have fuel on board For weeks. it was, it felt terrible for weeks. And so then I was like, "This is definitely not for me." So yeah, that's, you know- part of the issue out there, and some people that would tell you that fat adap- adaptation is the best way for athletes to, perform would tell me, I'm sure, that I just didn't give it long enough. my body wasn't actually fat adapted at that point, and so I just didn't, wait it out long enough. And to that I would say I don't want to. I did not want to. could I have felt better afterwards? Maybe. But I... It wasn't worth it to me to not feel that way, and also not eat carbs. who doesn't love a good baguette? let's be so for real. we had that take and bake baguette the other night with dinner, and it was, like, crunchy and crispy and so delicious. I like that you went with baguette. Yeah. Yeah. I would've just gone with- Cookies pasta myself, but- Pasta but baguette is also a delicious choice. I love bread. Bread is so good. Bread is good. All right. So let's talk about- But there have been some elite endurance athletes out there- Yeah who have been keto. And so there's people out on social media that argue, "Oh, but look at these couple of athletes. They've performed at very high levels." Yes. There are always outliers. And that's my argument. That's my counterargument is these are essentially outliers. Yeah. They are outliers among outliers. 'Cause you're looking at some of the best athletes in the world, they're already so far off the bell curve. Yeah. And then they changed their diet and still were excelling. It seems like they probably could have excelled off of essentially anything. Yeah, there's just always those people that are more metabolically flexible, and I think, again, those are some of the outliers, and so we can't base our recommendations on that for everyone. So let's first talk a little bit about carbohydrates because how much do we actually need? What ac- is actually beneficial? What does it actually do? So basically, your performance, as an endurance athlete, like Kevin mentioned- Your body's preferred source of fuel is glucose, okay? Ultimately, glucose is sugar, and that glucose gets released into your bloodstream, and then your blood takes your glucose out to your working muscles. It's to your brain, your heart, your lungs. everything operates, it- glucose is the preferred source of fuel. Yes, there are other energy pathways in the body, but glucose is, during exercise, is going to be what's most preferred. So carbohydrates, obviously, people are, have done a lot of research into carbohydrates because carbohydrates get broken down into glucose, okay? So that's how it all works, is like there's a long pathway of any carbohydrates that you eat get broken down until all of them are molecules of glucose. And that goes into your blood, and whatever you don't use gets stored in the body as glycogen, and glycogen gets stored in your muscles and in your liver. And if it doesn't, if those glycogen storage centers are full, then it can also get stored as fat, which is one of the reasons why people say that carbs and sugar make you fat because, yes, excess glucose, just e- any excess calories, excess fat in the body also gets stored as fat. Like, when you have excess calories in the body that your body doesn't use, then it does and can store them as fat because fat is basically your body's storage mechanism when all the other stuff is full. Yes. So as you're exercising, if this glycogen storage starts running lower, your body, essentially the same way as a car driving down the street, as the fuel tank starts to get lower, it flashes up the little light that says, "Hey, you're running low on fuel." Okay, wait, hold on. Before we, so before we- Before we hit the analogy? Yeah, before we get into that analogy. So when you're exercising, then your muscle, your body, goes into those glycogen stores in your muscle and your liver, but mostly the muscles gets used up first, and starts to break down, there's another pathway, to break down glycogen to then turn it into glucose to then send it into the working muscles. Yes. Okay? So that's now where we can pick up with Kevin's analogy of, like, when your glycogen- stores run low, okay? 'Cause th- those are your, that your body's stored form of glucose, okay? So when we, our body starts running low on glycogen, what, what happens with your car? So then it essentially flashes up this warning sign, "Hey, you're running low on fuel. You should start burning less fuel." Okay, now, if we were driving, it wouldn't even be like a warning sign. It'd just be if your car wouldn't let you go that fast anymore. Yeah. Because at higher speeds, your engine has to work harder, and so it would literally just cap your speed and be like, no, you can only drive this fast now." That's what your body's doing in a race, and it happens so far before you run out of fuel. you're at, half a tank, and your body's "Ooh, we're running low. I should start slowing down." And it just, it naturally starts giving you a smaller amount of fuel. You still have plenty of fuel in the tank. Yeah. And even beyond the glycogen stores, you then have all the fat stores in the tank. You've got so much fuel on board. But by adding carbohydrates, like by actually consuming them as you're exercising, it makes them more readily available. And so when your glycogen starts to run low, you have to remember that your body's first priority always is survival. So when your glycogen starts to run low, that's when your body starts, like Kevin said, decreasing the amount of glucose and glycogen that are available to you because it's trying to hold on, because it doesn't know how long are we gonna be running here, What are we doing? How, for how long? how long do I need to make this last? it's starting to try to ration it. And so this is why your perceived effort level goes up, your pace drops, and the bar- the body can actually start breaking down muscle tissue for fuel as well. your body can actually become catabolic and actually breaking down tissue for fuel. And so this is why when you add fuel in, if you're fueling during your training- Then that helps to preserve the glycogen because your body then doesn't have to break down that stored form of glucose because there's enough glucose already in your bloodstream that it can send out to wherever you need it. So it's gonna be easier for you to maintain your pace, and it's going to also protect the muscle that you're working so hard to build. Yes. So instead of essentially trying to transform glycogen into glucose, which is a whole process in the first place- you just consume glucose. Yeah. And in the newer fuels, you consume a combination of glucose and fructose- and because the body can quickly turn fructose into glucose, and you can actually use higher levels. So for a long time, the suggestion, and you could check this based off of, the standard gels that were being sold, was to consume about 30 to 45 grams of carbs per hour. Standard gels were somewhere around 20 or 25, and they suggested to take a couple of them an hour. Yeah. that was, like, the old goo that I had back when I was still in high school. Yeah. And newer suggestions are pushing this a little bit up that, midline tends to be around 60, and there are people that are pushing that number way higher. But for the purposes of let's give a general outline here, I think starting around 60 is a pretty safe bet. You go- And by starting, he means building up to that. Sure. Because, a lot of times, especially if you haven't supplemented with carbs before and you just try to go all in at 60 grams per hour, then you... that can lead to some GI upset for some people, especially if you have a more sensitive stomach. If you have a more sensitive stomach, you may get that initially. I think that you can get to 60 pretty quickly without GI issues. That's why I say that's a decent starting point. You also have an iron gut. I did not used to have an iron gut. Okay. What I'm saying is a lot of the fuel sources that are out there- and this is a different category if you're going whole food, and we can get to that in a second here. Yeah. But some of these sources that are really, they are incredibly super refined sugars that you're taking in, so the body doesn't have to do a whole lot of work to break them down and use them. Yeah. And as long as you take them with enough water, and a lot of the new gels are coming out that have enough water in them. It, 15, 20 years ago it said, "Take this gel and then make sure that you have it with plenty of water." Because it would mess up i- the body's ability to absorb it out of the stomach, and it would just sit there in your stomach or your upper small intestine and make you just feel, terrible. It would brought about this feeling of bloating because your body wasn't actually absorbing the sugar. So one, you were still under fueled because your body wasn't absorbing anything, and you were feeling bloated because it was just sitting there. Yeah. So the newer fuels just make... Are they're easier to absorb by your body. Okay. So then if you're using some of those newer fuels, then it probably will be easier for you to take in more carbs per hour sooner- Yes without as much gut adaptation. Yes. Okay. That is my argument of if you're taking a newer, nice carb- Yeah nice source, 60 is actually a pretty reasonable place to start. So an important thing to remember is that we're gonna s- we're gonna give you guys some numbers because this is the, these are the numbers that are, have been supported by the research and by evidence out there and by peop- anecdotal evidence as well. so 30 to 60 grams per hour during endurance exercise longer than 60 to 90 minutes can meaningfully improve performance. And like Kevin said, some people are pushing that number up to, 90 grams per hour, some even up over that, right? but again, technology is continuing to improve every day, and sports technology, sports nutrition are making these things more readily absorbed by the body, so then the body's gonna be able to take more of that in. But if you're not taking anything, start taking something, and that should improve as well. Ooh, that's an excellent point. If you're taking... 30 is better than zero. Yeah. And 20 is better than zero, too. Yes. So if you are like 30, oh my gosh, start with something, right? Start somewhere because one of the big supplements that we like to take that we use, and again, we don't have an affiliate code, we have no, financial, gain from this, is a supplement called Skratch. And that has 18 grams of sugar, 18 grams of carbs. Yep Per tablespoon, and you put that into your water, and you sip that over time. So if you, it takes you an hour to get through that's only 18 grams, so that's half of, even in this window. Yeah, and so that's usually what's in my bottle- because that's a good place to have some extra nutrition on board. An add-on. Yeah. Yeah. Like it, that to me, that's a- A supplement to your supplement It's a supplement to my supplement- Yeah. is essentially how I look at that. Exactly. But if you're starting at zero, I would strongly suggest to start by putting some calories- like some sort of sports drink. Liquid calories- Yeah is probably the easiest place to start for your stomach. Because it's the most easily absorbed. Don't over-scoop. Don't be like, "Oh, if one scoop's good, three scoops is better." It's gonna be harder to drink and harder to absorb. Yeah. Just try something. Right, and this is important because most recreational runners that are doing runs of 60 minutes or more are often taking in zero carbohydrates during that, and they're asking their body to perform on an increasingly empty tank, right? Because it's, your tank, depending on if you eat beforehand, 'cause some people go out and run fasted and don't eat before their runs. Oh, please don't do that. this is wh- but this is what pe- some people are doing, right? I know. Please stop doing that, though. so people s- don't ru- don't eat before their run, and then they go out, and they don't consume anything, and they're running over 60 minutes. your tank is just continuing to get emptier and emptier, and then you wonder why the last miles are feeling so hard, or why your recovery is taking so long, or why you are so hungry for the rest of the day, and it's because you didn't give your body the fuel that it needed while you were training. Yeah, I like that you added some of the things that trickle on for hours afterwards. that, because that's- Why am I ravenous for the next six hours? Why do I have- Yeah brain fog in the afternoon? Yes. It's not, it- It's not just performance-based. Yeah. It's how you feel the rest of the day, too. yes. Yeah. You have to make sure that there is plenty of food, and the day after a particularly long or hard workout is not the time to be like, "Oh, it's a recovery day. I'm not even exercising today because I went so long and hard yesterday- Yeah that today I can back off." no. You really need to make sure that you are fueling that next day as well. It is super important that you are always fueling your body enough. Yes. Now, we're gonna talk a little bit about my ladies here, especially my ladies over 40, and why this matters even more. So declining estrogen can affect insulin sensitivity and glycogen storage. So your body kinda changes the way that it processes carbs. Now, again, that statement is controversial. There are some people that tell you that is absolutely true, and there are some people that tell you that is not true, and that's just more, pink labels on what's going on for women and just- Ooh, pink labels making women think that they're special little fairies that need special- Women are special. we are. there's no doubt about that, right? But- The body's ability to access and use carbohydrates for fuel during training can also change during perimenopause and menopause. And I think that this means that adequate carbohydrate intake becomes even more important, not less important, as you get older, because your body's ability to use them effectively starts to change. And this is really against a lot of the low carb and keto messaging aimed at women in this age group. There's a lot of people that think that they should not be eating carbs after 40, or they should eat less carbs. I was just having this conversation with my friend last week at dinner, and she was telling me how she's been gaining weight, and she just doesn't understand, and she doesn't get it. She's been eating a Mediterranean style diet, and she hasn't really been eating carbs. "I don't- I basically don't eat carbs anymore." And I'm like, honey, your body needs carbs." Like especially- Here, have a baguette. and, 'cause she was telling me that, and she was saying, and I, she, lost her job as well, so she's "I've had all this time, so I've been going to barre class like five days a week, and I've been running three days per week." And so she's increased her exercise and decreased her carbohydrates, which is just not a good combination 'cause your body doesn't have the fuel that it needs. So then you're talking about all day long. When you constantly put your body in a caloric deficit- Yeah all day long, it's just gonna continue to dial back further and further on your metabolism. Correct. And you can't access the fuel as well. Now, one of the things that there is a difference between men and women on fueling during the run because women have greater ability to access their fat stores at faster and higher speeds. It's... I'm a little jealous of that skill that you have. It is interesting, but like that is-- They have shown that in research, but then you always ask what does that actually mean? How does that actually translate to performance?" Because just because women can access the fat stores doesn't necessarily mean that they can s- use them More effectively. there's still emerging research on that. Like it's still one of those question mark areas that we're not really sure. yes, we do see this biological difference, but what does that actually mean? that's why I like to put the blanket statement as start at 60 grams and then adjust from there. Okay. Because there are some anecdotal stories. Yeah. All anecdotal stories. There are some women that hit 60, they go above that, and they just start feeling terrible. It doesn't matter what the source of fuel is, it doesn't feel as well. But they're not getting a drop-off in performance. If you tested them, they're probably burning fat through the roof. Whereas other women are able to get to 60 and then push that even higher, and they feel great on- Yeah all purely anecdotal stuff off of that. But start at 60, it's a good baseline to me. But look at the difference in body types and body sizes and fat storage. there are just different bo- they're just different bodies, and those different bodies use fuel differently. Your body burns fuel much differently than mine. Like you eat a much heavier carbohydrate diet than I do, and you do not have much fat on your body at all. I'm literally currently enjoying a baguette as we record. A baguette. But I think it's really important to also- Talk about this aspect of diet culture and the messaging because there's this messaging out there that carbs are bad and that we should limit carbs, especially as women over 40. In perimenopause and post-menopause, carbs become the devil, and that is not good advice for us as women athletes because we have been told for a long time now that carbohydrates, they cause weight gain, that they should be minimized, and that eating less is always better. But that is one of the biggest reason why I see runners plateau or struggle to recover or just feel chronically exhausted, because they're not eating enough carbs when that's really what their body needs. So carbs for you as a runner, I don't care how old you are, carbs are not the enemy. Carbs are fuel. They're your body's preferred source of fuel, and under-fueling is not doing you any good. It's not showing you that you're more disciplined. It's not going to help you lose fat. It's going to limit your performance. so if you care about your performance, if you wanna be able to run longer, or if you wanna be able to run faster, or you wanna feel better, or you wanna avoid injury, you have to make sure that you are taking in an adequate amount of carbs. That doesn't mean that you have to be over-eating carbs, but you need to be taking in an adequate amount of carbohydrates. Yes, not overdoing it, making sure that you're actually paying attention to the effort levels that you're going at. Because while 60 is a great thing and saying if you're even getting close to an hour long of workout, making sure that you're fueling the effort is important. If it's a very easy workout, 60 is overdoing it. if you're like, "Oh no, it was a brisk hike that I went on" and you're used to going out and running, at a much faster pace- Yeah it would be helpful to put some fuel onto that hike, but y- you don't need to be hitting it at 60 grams an hour. Like- we were just talking about the Cogedona experience. And Rachel Enterkin, I was just gonna say, I've got her name, it's coming to me. She started fueling at around 60, but as the race went on, she dropped it, and then raised it back up, and then dropped it, depending on what the temperature was. Depending on if she was going up a mountain, down- Yeah she had some flexibility in it. She had a goal- Yeah but then she had flexibility depending on what was currently happening. At low points where she wasn't able to push her body as much, she didn't need to fuel it as much. Yeah. So carbohydrate, that's a great example. and the same thing happened with you, in all of your ultra races as well, especially the Keys. Like, when I think about the first Keys 100, which was your- Oh your first attempt- God, that was terrible at, But we, I had a whole spreadsheet. I was, like, writing down everything that Kevin was eating and, calculating how many carbs per hour and all of that, and there just got to a point where he was taking in so many carbs, his gut was just in knots. he literally could not take in any more food, so we had to adjust. you're always going to have to adjust, and I think it's really important that- To remember that carbohydrate needs do vary, not just based on where you are in your 100-mile race, but they vary based on your training volume, intensity, body size, individual metabolism, and like Kevin said, the specific demands of that session. It's very important to take into account, what you're doing in that session. So the numbers that we told you so far, those are evidence-based guidelines, not precise prescriptions for every single runner. Those are guidelines, a good place to start, and then you have to figure out how your body responds to that and then adjust. Yeah. and make sure you're hydrating during that- because the body finds it very difficult to absorb anything- Yeah if you don't give it water. And so if you have any sort of GI issues, we would highly recommend trying different sources, right? 'Cause Kevin said, the sports science and the sports nutrition world is really changing at a very rapid rate, and they're coming out with new products, regularly. And so maybe you d- you couldn't tolerate the old goos or gels, but some of the new stuff that's coming out that has more water in there might be more easy, easier on your stomach. Oh, yeah. More tolerable. And there's, there are so many options out there, and we are not sponsored by any of them. No. And so we are not brand specific to any of them. No, we're not. you have one that you like. I like it- But- because it's one of the cheapest ones on the market. There you go. So- If you're not taking in anything, if you're running more than 60 minutes and you're taking in zero carbs, that's gonna be one of the first things. That's the first place to go is start to take in carbs before your run, no matter what length of a run you're going on. And then if you're going on a 60-minute or more, run, you're gonna wanna start to take in carbs on that run, and that's gonna be one of the highest leverage pieces that you can pull, more than any of the other supplements that we're gonna talk about today. All right, I think we've covered that guy. Section two- 29 minutes on carbs. I- there was a lot. we're not. So w- I don't know if we're gonna be getting to all of the other supplements that we are possibly going to talk about today. And again, if we don't, we'll make another episode about it. Yeah, sure. But I- All right, so let's move on to the second C. We, we gotta get to the second C here. Yeah. which is creatine. Creatine. Creatine's a good one. Creatine has a ton of research behind it. Yeah. Creatine is useful. Can you explain what creatine is? 'Cause it's not a drug. What actually is creatine? So creatine is actually a naturally occurring compound in the body. your body naturally produces creatine. It's produced primarily in the liver and the kidneys, and it's stored mostly in the muscle. So it is made from amino acids, and your body takes that. Your body produces creatine. The issue with creatine production is, when people learn that they're like, if my body's doing that, why do I need to take a supplement?" And a lot of times it's because... we're gonna talk about that. So your body takes creatine and uses it- to help rapidly regenerate ATP, okay? Adenosine triphosphate. Ooh, adenosine triphosphate. Let's go back to Bio 101, right? So ATP is your muscle's primary energy source, especially during shorter high intensity efforts, okay? So like the final push of a race or a hard hill repeat or a heavy strength set. Like, when you're trying to muscle out those last couple repetitions and you're trying to go out for an all-out effort, that's what ATP is most primarily used for. I thought ATP was the fuel of literally every activity. No, it is. it's energy source, for sure. But when you l- if you, when you think about the biological energy pathways in the body- Okay, yeah The specific pathway of A- 'Cause, the Krebs cycle- Yes if we're gonna go back all the way to Bio 101, like the Krebs cycle produces, 34 ATP. Yes. So it produces the 32 plus the two extra ones in the other pathways. Yes. But there's- Another pathway, like a creatine pathway, where your body can rapidly regenerate ATP. Yes. 'Cause the Krebs cycle takes oxygen and takes time. That's actually fat oxidation that we were- Yeah talking about before. So there's, yes, there's the other pathway that uses- There's other- the creatine, of course. Correct. And then there's, there's- That's why you would need the creatine 'cause there's the glycolytic pathway, which is the glucose pathway that we talked about. this is getting a little bit too science-y, right? I'm getting- So there's- so excited over here- There's different- when you start talking science there's different energy pathways in the body, right? So when you break down carbohydrates, that's gonna be more of the glycolytic pathway, then you've got the fat burning, which is the Krebs cycle, and then we've got a creatine pathway as well. Okay, so we need the creatine because it helps us flip ADP back into ATP, then we can break that down and actually fuel our body. Yes, through the phosphagen system, if we wanna get all the bio terms in here. I just wanted to say ADP and ATP. And then if you go crazy to break it all the way down into AMP. AMP? Oh, yeah, adenosine monophosphate. Anyway. So yes, so that's basically what creatine does. so creatine is really helpful in those harder effort, kind of max effort types of things. So you do get small amounts of creatine through food, primarily through red meat and fish. But it's, real small amounts. Correct. it, I was reading one article today. It was like you would have to eat, I forget how much, 1,800 pounds of cer- the amount of calories that- Yeah and, and- Yeah, it's like you could, you could- grams that you would have to eat in order to get, one to two grams, was- It's, you could totally consume- Yeah fish for it, but you'd have to actually fill your swimming pool just with fish- Yeah and then go. so dietary intake alone, typically, if you're eating red meat and fish and good sources of creatine, will cover only about half of what your muscles can store. And so this is one of the reasons why s- creatine supplementation has been so well-researched, because supplementation can help to fill that gap between what you c- what your muscles can store and what you can get through diet. Okay. So now m- while creatine is making a big push now- back when we were in high school, there was a big push for creatine, and one of the key things that I remember is this were for dudes that wanted to get huge in the gym. Yeah. And you had to be careful that you drank enough water because you were gonna cramp up like crazy. These are the two things that I remember about creatine when I was in high school. I- is there any sort of viability to this? yes and no. So yes, because, it does help with strength gains. And so guys that can get jacked, that's gonna help with that. And then, y- for cramping, yes, because creatine does need more water. That's one of the reasons that the side effects, for a lot of people can be bloating, especially if they're doing the loading phase, which we- we're gonna talk about a little bit later. Okay, good. So bloating and water, muscle cramping, these things are possibly related. So g- We just have to be smart about the way we take it, like anything. So you just have to be intelligent- Yeah about your usage here. All right, so let's talk about what the research is showing and, specifically more recent research. So there was a 2021 systematic review and meta-analysis of randomized trials in older females, okay? So that alone, every, all those fun words I just said, means that it's good research, okay? So we want s- a systematic review basically takes a looks at lots of different studies and concludes, looking at all of these studies, what do they all show us? And the fact that it was a meta-analysis is also a really good thing. Done on randomized controlled trials, which is the highest level of research, also very good. So basically what this found was that adding creatine to resistance training produced significant gains in strength versus just training alone, especially in programs lasting 24 weeks or more, okay? Now again, this is a supplement. So this, there was another 25, 2025 study Of creatine supplemen- supplementation, combined with resistance training in perimenopausal and post-menopausal, over 14 weeks that also showed improvements in muscle strength and body composition. But the critical thing that we all have to pay attention to in here was it- this was not just people taking creatine. This was creatine combined with resistance training. So it- creatine alone without the training stimulus is not going to produce the same benefits as when you combine it with the training, which really goes back to the foundation episode that we were talking about. So the resistance training actually had benefits. Yes. It's just that resistance training with creatine on top of it had s- like actually significantly greater benefits- Yeah like in a research base- 'Cause a- significant 'cause a lot of what they find is that the creatine allows your muscles... Like it can help with muscle fatigue. So you're allowed... You can basically pump out like another couple of reps. So if you're able to get a little bit more work in, then your muscles are going to gain the benefit from that. Yeah, simply doing- It's not that, it's not that the creatine is doing that to the muscles. The creatine is allowing you to work harder in the gym. Yeah, because you're already in the gym. Yeah. Creatine was an add-on to the resistance training. So you're already doing the work, and now you're able to do work at a slightly higher level. You're going to get greater results out of this. But if you just take creatine and you work out the same in the gym, it may or may not do anything for you, right? 'Cause the goal for these programs to, for a lot of them, I didn't look at the design of every single trial, but the programs are gonna take the muscle either to failure or close to failure. that's generally how they're designed. You can't- and so creatine- You can't go through and check its meta-analysis. They already did it for you. so creatine then just helps to push that ceiling a little higher. Which is excellent. So k- if you're pushing to failure just is a higher ceiling. So that's You're gonna get greater benefits. Exactly. so but there has been some interesting research that is, is new, and again, these are all new things that they're we can't really make a lot of generalizations from yet. But there has been some very interesting beginning research, really la- just last year in 2025 that showed that creatine supplementation, c- can help to enhance reaction time. and then there m- may be a benefit in cognitive impairment. Okay? So th- we're showing that there is possibly some brain benefits to taking creatine- especially in perimenopausal and post-menopausal women. this makes sense, and this is now me just throwing speculation at it. But this makes sense because the brain uses an enormous amount of energy. Yeah. And so if creatine is able to make energy more easily accessible- 'cause that's what it does is it recreates the ATP so you have an energy source- Yeah it would make sense that you would be able to improve brain function. And it's also showing some- Very interesting benefits with sleep quality as well, especially among perimenopausal women that reported fewer nighttime awakenings, which then led to obviously better overall energy levels and overall quality of life. 'Cause anytime you can improve sleep, you're gonna get benefits from that, right? So- I think we covered that last week. Yeah, exactly. Sleep is definitely one of those huge rocks, that we need better sleep. and sleep is one of the things that a lot of perimenopausal women have trouble with. Because of all the hormone changes that are happening, there's a lot of sleep disruptions. And, stress is definitely a big piece of that as well, like the, that time of our life. So is it perimenopause? Is it the hormones? Or is it just the fact that 50-year-old women have a lot more stress going on in their life? Yeah, I'm also- I think it's probably a combination curious about those two studies together of- Yeah if creatine improves sleep quality- Yeah and creatine also improves brain function and reaction time. is it the creatine that's improving brain function, or is actually being able to sleep- Yeah improving brain function? And it's tough to dissect the two of them because, the body's real, real complicated. Yeah. and so these are promising things, but this is important for us to start to tease out, which is why we wanted to talk about it. Because social media, especially the influencers that will give you an affiliate link to buy their version of creatine, will tell you that creatine is this magic supplement, and it's not. It is very well-researched. It is safe, okay? Creatine monohydrate, that is, again, that is the form of creatine that has been the most researched. Creatine monohydrate at three to five grams per day has demonstrated long-term safety in healthy individuals, okay? So w- that is good. So most likely, creatine is not going to harm you, okay? So that's a really good thing. I haven't really- That's a great takeaway the only people that really need to be careful, as far as creatine goes is if you have any sort of kidney issues, okay? If you have kidney issues, you have to be careful. You wanna definitely- Check with your doctor, or if you're on any sort of medication that affects kidney function or, of course, as always, anyone pregnant or breastfeeding. You always wanna check with your doctor, when it comes to those kinds of things. But in general what are you laughing at? I just, I always- My disclaimers? I always love the pregnant and breastfeeding disclaimer. Yeah. That's because no one's doing research- where they're throwing creatine at somebody who's pregnant- because that's unethical. Yeah. So that research will never come. You can get people to speculate whether it may even possibly be harmful or not, but it's always gonna have the, "Don't take if breastfeeding-" Yeah or pregnant," because no one's possibly doing that unethical study. Yeah, so w- there's a lot of limitations when it comes to research in those areas, for sure. So anyway, it is safe, okay? But what it is not, okay, be very clear, creatine is not a weight loss tool. It does not burn fat. Oh, no, I've seen that online. No. Creatine magically burns fat. It does not burn fat. It does not. Oh, it does not. So one of the things that, people have noticed, and this is one of the reasons a l- a lot of women stay away from it, so to address what you were talking about earlier, with the cramping and stuff, early supplementation often does cause a small and temporary increase on the scale, about one to two pounds, due to water being drawn in. Because creatine just essentially makes your body hold on to water more. And so it's intracellular water, which is part of how creatine works. It needs that for the pathway that we were talking about before. It's not fat gain. So I think that's important for anybody listening, if you're going to try creatine, to understand that you might gain a couple of pounds, and that's just water. It's not and that's one of the reasons that people report bloating, okay? So when you, take creatine- There has been, like in the past, people would recommend going through what's called a loading phase, where you take more up- up front to get, get more into your muscle cells. But especially women, especially if you're using this for strength gains or, brain health or any of those things, if you want to test it out, that loading phase is not necessary. And so when you decrease the loading phase and just start taking that three to five grams, per day, if you're worried about bloating or cramping or any of those issues, start on the lower end with three grams per day and work yourself, work your way up to five. So the opposite of a loading phase? Yeah. Start low and work yourself up. Then it can decrease some of those, unwanted side effects. All right, so this bloating and increased water retention inside the cell, is that why people in the gym will literally take creatine at a higher dose because it makes their muscles look bigger- that's one- because they're holding water? That's one of the reasons that people always, made fun of creatine, remember? Yeah. 'Cause they were just like, "Oh, you're just like- You're- pumped up." Yeah. it's, because it- 'Cause your muscles are literally just mo- full of more water. They are. Yeah. Yeah, but they're- But it's also temporary. But, But th- that's, th- also keep in mind what the research s- showed was it was after 24 weeks. That's- Yes half the year. Yes, so that is a long time. That is six months, right? you're, so it takes time. This is not an overnight phenomenon or- Yeah like you're not gonna see overnight benefit. So creatine is beneficial. Yeah. Three to five grams, and it is going to take some time. It is not going to replace strength training, but it may in fact increase strength gains on top of strength training that you're already doing. Exactly. So if you want to try it- Creatine monohydrate is the best way to go. It's also, I think, the cheapest out there. It's the most well-researched. it's also the easy one to say, like- let's check the ingredients of whatever creatine you're buying. Yes. The ingredient should be creatine monohydrate. Yes. There sh- There should not be anything else on there there's not a second ingredient on there. That's all it is. One ingredient, yes, 'cause that has the most research and is the most effective. the dose, three to five grams a day. No loading phase necessary. so if you are consistently taking that at three to five grams a day, you will reach muscle saturation over three to four weeks without the GI side effects that can come with the loading protocols that we were talking about. and since the strength gains are happening over the course of months- I think it's gonna be fine that it takes three to four weeks- Yeah to reach saturation. And also, consistency matters more than timing. So a lot of people are always like, when should I take it? is it more effective if I take it before or after training or with food or whatnot?" and for the most part they're not, they don't really show, the research doesn't show that there's one ideal time to take it. So really the best time to take it is the time that you'll remember to take it every day. That's- Because consistency matters more than timing. there's, there was, there's some that shows that, maybe if you take it after or maybe if you take it before you train, there might be a slight advantage, but the most important thing is just taking it at every day at a time that you're going to remember. So again, we'll go back to last week's foundation, consistency- Yeah is super key. Whatever it is that you're doing, be real consistent with it. Exactly. All right. Any other questions that you have about creatine before we move on to the third C of caffeine? I think you answered my 17-year-old questions. Perfect. So nailed it. All right, good. And if you guys have questions on this podcast, we would love to hear them also. There's... if you listen to us on Spotify, there is a comments section, so if you have questions, that we didn't come up with, I would love to hear your questions either on that comments section on Spotify, you can DM us on Instagram, or you can also email us. You can email us at, podcast@realliferunners.com. All right, moving on to the third C, which is caffeine. Now, this is one that most of us don't have any problem with. we're already taking in a decent amount of caffeine every day, right? Love me the caffeine. Exactly. So what we want to talk about here is really understanding it, how to use it in a way that's actually supported by research, and also, looking at some of the limitations here as well. All right. So we're very clear and upfront about possible conflicts of interest here. I was actually voted, most caffeinated teacher- this year in the yearbook. So I just- Conflict of interest I just want to put that out there before we really dive into the caffeine section. Most caffeinated teacher cracks me up because you have, half a cup of coffee a day. I have one very small cup of coffee, but withou- And this is why I got it, because without it, I'm not really functional. it takes me most of first period to drink my cup of coffee, and the kids know during that period I'm gonna make three or four math errors on the board. Call me on them. Call me on them quick, because- Oh my gosh I don't... I gotta fix them. Okay. So you're a perfect example of, the second piece that I want to talk about, which is the individual response to caffeine. Because that is a- Oh, that's a good piece it's, it's a huge part of it, right? Because you and I have very different responses to caffeine. So- That's true and that really applies to everything in life, right? So what does the research show? Caffeine is actually one of the most consistently researched supported performance supplements for endurance athletes, okay? they've researched caffeine. This is why you see caffeine in a lot of the carbohydrate supplements that you buy. A lot of the gels and goos also- Yeah, you do have caffeine added to them, because it is very well researched. It's not a, it's not a coincidence that those carbs and that caffeine are there together, because essentially what caffeine does, the primary mechanism of action is that it reduces perceived effort. So the run or the workout, whatever you're doing, feels less hard at the same pace. So that's a good thing, right? Like you can run a- That's a great thing yeah, you can run a faster pace or you can run your normal pace and it doesn't feel as hard. So that's fantastic, right? It also helps to mobilize fat as a fuel source, which is relevant for those longer efforts, right? Those longer endurance events where you want to s- maybe start to tap into the fat stores. That's why I like dripping in caffeine throughout- ridiculously long aerobic efforts. Dripping in caffeine? Yes. That just made me think of the Bruno Mars song, where's, like Dripping in Finesse. Perfect. Yes. Something like that. That's, I also like to drip in finesse- He does in the middle of ultramarathons. He does. but I do. I like- That's exactly how I would describe you when you come in around mile 50. Yes. You're just dripping in finesse. there's a lot of stuff dripping by mile 50. let's go with that. But the mile 50 is like when you're spicy. Yes. and that's- And by spicy cranky. But that's when you need to give me some extra caffeine. There we go. Because the caffeine d- now we have a hack. it helps- Yeah, it does because it makes everything just feel a little bit nicer. Your brain is just in a hap- my brain is certainly in a happier place- on a little bit of extra caffeine. So if you guys want the fun numbers, there's a 2025 systematic review that found that caffeine at three to six milligrams per kilogram of body weight consistently improved power output and technical performance across multiple studies. So if you are around 150 pounds, that's approximately 200 to 400 milligrams of caffeine, which is roughly two to four cups of coffee, 'cause you want to assume that there's about 100 milligrams of coffee, or of caffeine in a cup of coffee. so and you want to take this like 45 to 60 minutes before training or racing. Now, with that being said- I was gonna say, this is gonna be good. What? I was g- Because there's so much individuality in those numbers- Well- that you just put there there is. There's definitely individual responses, but what I was also going to mention is that you have to be careful about the GI things. 'Cause for a lot of people, taking coffee or caffeine can really help to speed up the motility of your gut, which means you gotta poop. you gotta make sure that you take it far enough in advance so that you can kinda clear out before- Far enough in advance- Yeah but not so far in advance that if you're a rapid caffeine metabolizer, it's not really doing anything for you anymore. Correct. Correct. So individual response to caffeine varies significantly based on lots of things. So there's, it's, there's actually a gene, that governs how quickly caffeine is metabolized, so that's pretty fun. Yep. So you and I must have differences in this gene because Kevin, like he mentioned, caffeine affects him a lot more. So he can drink a little bit of caffeine and he really feels a significant difference. I drink multiple cups of coffee per day, and I just say that I drink it because I like it. I don't even feel like I need coffee every day. I just genuinely enjoy it. I think that the, I, this has been a while and I'm not pulling up recent research. I'm just trying to recall things I've heard on podcasts about caffeine. I think that the mean, half-life of caffeine is something like six hours in the body. It's five to seven. There you go. Excellent. Well done. I did remember that one. Yeah. And that means that whatever you've taken in, six hours later- you still have half of it that you're working with. Yeah. So if you're gonna try and take in some for 45 minutes, an hour beforehand, it still has plenty of caffeine in your system- Yeah by the time the race gets going. It takes a little bit of time for your body to see any benefits from it, though. It does. So to me, I need at least 30 minutes before I'm gonna start feeling something. And so depending on whether or not you're a fast metabolizer or a slow metabolizer, it can also affect how th- that caffeine affects you. I shouldn't say it can. it will. It affects how that caffeine affects you. And so if you are a fast metabolizer of caffeine, you're gonna respond well to those standard doses. But if you're a slow metabolizer of caffeine, you can actually... they've actually shown that those people can actually experience a performance decline, and it can also raise anxiety. It can elevate their heart rate or cause GI distress at doses that work for others. So those people might need smaller doses to actually gain a benefit and not have those unwanted side effects, 'cause they... people just get too jittery. Yeah, 'cause what you don't want is the combination of jittery and a raised heart rate. Raised heart rate then is going to increase your perceived effort levels. Yes. none of this is gonna go very well for you, so you wanna make sure that you find a level that works for you. Which honestly, like a cup of coffee, if a cup of coffee works for you, that's fine. Yeah. For performance, maybe have a bigger cup of coffee. But see how it goes. Try this out beforehand. Don't try it on race day. Yeah. Also, e- exactly. nothing new on race day. Always try it out in a training run first. So if- Quadrupling caffeine on race day seems like a dangerous- Not a good idea, yeah sprint to a bathroom. So just know yourself, right? if you've ever had caffeine, if you've ever had a cup of coffee or any sort of drink that has had caffeine, how does it make you feel? If caffeine makes you feel jittery, anxious, or worse on a regular basis, you might not wanna use that during training, or you might wanna use a much lower dose during training, and you definitely wanna practice using it during training before you try to use it in any sort of race or performance situation. So- Just know that's a metabolic response. You might just be a slow metabolizer, and that's okay. Yeah, you can also increase your tolerance to caffeine over time. Yes, also very important. and it takes a while to decrease. So the idea, I've seen this before with people that are like, in the week leading up to a race you should stop taking caffeine so that it allows your body to then have a better reaction to it during the race." Yeah. That seems to all be baloney based off of, a little dicey research, but a whole heck of a lot of anecdotes of people that are like, "No, it just makes you crabby- Yeah for the three to five days before the race." and- Just have your coffee and not only that, like you also that have... You do tend to be more sensitive to caffeine. Kevin will get a headache if he doesn't have caffeine, right? I don't really... I don't know the last time I didn't have coffee. You may get a headache. to be fair. No, I, I don't though, 'cause I... There has been a time that there ha- I'm sure- Right? I'm sure there has been a day. I'm sure there has been a day. But, you are definitely much more sensitive and are affected. if you don't have coffee, you'll typically always end up with a headache for the most part. Almost every time. And That tolerance, you've built up a tolerance to over time, and then your body is showing signs of withdrawal if you don't actually have it. And so that's important to know so that if you are leading up to a race and you take caffeine away and your body is going through withdrawal in the days leading up to a race, like that's not gonna be a good thing either. The taper tantrums and withdrawal seem like a bad combination. How about no? But like you, you mentioned, caffeine does have a half-life, and it's important to keep that in mind, especially if you're gonna take caffeine with your training. What time of day do you train, right? Because if you have a 3:00 PM coffee, there's a lot of people that have that kind of mid-afternoon coffee because they're starting to get tired, that caffeine is still in your system at 9:00 or 10:00 PM. And so if you are, especially if you're a woman in perimenopause and you are already having disrupted sleep, the performance benefit or the, that 3:00 PM coffee that you're having could really be adding to that sleep disruption and making your sleep worse, which is ultimately going to negatively affect your performance. Because the small performance benefit that you're gonna gain from caffeine is definitely not bigger than the negative consequences of not getting enough sleep. No, that's really well stated. But again, this is all super dosage dependent. If you have a s- like the one, carb source that I have has 50 grams, 50 milligrams of caffeine- in a serving of it. That's not that much. And if you have built up some tolerance, you could totally have that at 3:00 PM and have no problems going to sleep that night. But even I, like the, I know that I metabolize caffeine well. I typically still don't have coffee after around noon. there are some times where I'll go over to the coffee pot and around 1:00 and pour some and they'll, there will still be some coffee left in the pot, and I don't like wasting coffee. it's just not- Yeah it's not in me. Yeah. Yeah. It's the Italian in me. So I do sometimes have it, but, never after 2:00. Yeah. But I'm saying that you probably could have a small amount around 3:00. I probably could, but I also don't think it would be worth it. When I'm racing for 18 hours, I will have caffeine wh- whatever time. Yeah. And I will usually still be able to sleep that night. yeah, when you race for that long, your body's gonna sleep no matter what. But that's the thing is like the jitteries from doing a race- in combination with caffeine way later than I, I would normally take it- Yeah I can still mentally shut myself down. I think probably just due to complete physical exhaustion. But- There is some benefit of using this during a race, and I can feel it. And even if that's placebo effect of knowing I just took a caffeinated substance, give me about 30 minutes and I should be doing great. In 30 minutes I'll check my watch and be like, "Oh yeah, it's go time now." It's kicked in now. Yeah. And I don't care if it's placebo or not. Who cares? I feel good. Yeah. Therefore, it's winning. Perfect. So if you do plan to use caffeine on race day, always practice it in training first. Make sure that you're paying attention to the dose, the timing, and the source. Okay? You never want to introduce a new caffeine protocol on race day. All of those things matter because coffee's going to deliver caffeine to your system a little bit differently than a gel, a caffeinated gel is going to deliver it. Yeah, because is the caffeine coming out of coffee or- is it like a green tea extract or- there's all sorts of things, and some of them may send you to a bathroom and some of them won't. Yep. And it's still just caffeine. True. Which is weird that some will send you and some won't. I know. So the performance benefit for endurance athletes, it's bigger in longer efforts where fatigue accumulates, okay? Because that's one of the things that caffeine does is it helps make your body less resist- or more resistant to fatigue. That's true. Your muscles become less fatigue resistant. Did I say that right? More fati- more fatigue resistant. More fatigue resistant. Yeah. Yeah, so the fatigue doesn't affect you as much. Yeah, it just doesn't feel as hard. And so if, There's limited benefit in those shorter races, right? The benefit might be smaller if you're doing it shorter races, especially if you have any sort of GI risk or other things going. Yeah, 'cause you don't want to just, ramp yourself up on caffeine. there's a point of getting yourself fired up, but if you go too far and you just get all anxious and jittery- that's not gonna be a good race. So as always, caffeine is not a substitute for adequate sleep or fueling. That's why- Or training or training, for sure. so using it to try to compensate and being like, "Oh, th- this is gonna help me not fatigue as much." if you don't get enough sleep, you're not gonna. Fat- It- Caffeine's not gonna do much for you. If you don't get enough sleep and you didn't actually get in any of your long runs in marathon training- No it doesn't matter if you take a gram of caffeine. It's just, it's not gonna be a great race for you. It is not. All right. So we are now al- almost 58 minutes in here, so we did def- definitely did not have time to address, some of the other supplements that we are gonna talk about today. There were so many more I wanted to talk about. we can... I feel like it's gonna be, we... It's gonna add on, another 10. People may want it. Let's do it. It may add on another hour. An- another hour. it's possible. We have a lot less information about these ones because the research is not as good on these ones. So why don't we just briefly mention them? All right, let's, let's go for it. Let's do it. Okay, so these supplements that we're gonna be talking about now, they do have some good research behind them, but, it's... There's not... They might not be, like, as specific to runners. the ones that we talked about already, the three Cs, that, all three of those have good research and good research for runners and endurance athletes, okay? Yes. So the ones that we're gonna be talking about now, s- they, the research behind them is pretty good, but we have to figure out how much that applies to us as runners or endurance athletes. But we'll let you know how we're speculating how that is, in fact, gonna be a good thing for us. Okay, so let's talk about vitamin D. Vitamin D is one of these vitamins, and I'm just going to tell you this right now. This statement is my personal opinion. I think that vitamin D, based on, based... it's based on the research, right? But, based on all the things that I've read and my own personal experience, I think vitamin D is one of those things that does more than we realize that it does. And as more research comes out, we start to realize all of the different effects that vitamin D has in the body. And one of the reasons I first started getting into looking into vitamin D was I was having restless leg syndrome and some weird, neurological things, and it actually does have some very interesting, research and things w- when it comes to neurological health. but the research does show that- Vitamin D is very important for bone health. It helps to aid in calcium absorption and preventing stress fractures. It helps improve muscle function, and it reduces respiratory infections in athletes, okay? So there is some actual good evidence about that for vitamin D. Okay. So the question, and 'cause we're going full honesty on this thing, do you take vitamin D? I do, and that is because I have a deficiency, okay? full Clarity, transparency I do not Yeah. So I think that, you do not take it- I do not take or you do not have a deficiency? I do not take vitamin D. But have you had your vitamin D levels tested? definitely not recently, 'cause you need to schedule your- no doc- Vitamin D was tested in my last blood test. Where, but when was that? January. Oh, good. Look at you. Maybe February. I think- Oh, yeah, that's right. You did have an appointment this year. Yeah, I did. I'm so proud of you. And they were like, "Hey, would you like us to test this?" And I said yes- Yeah to everything they asked. And so one of the things about vitamin D is that people always tell you that vitamin D is created by the sun. And so I figured living in Florida, spending time in the sun, especially as a runner, I was gonna have plenty of adequate vitamin D. but despite assumptions that, we outdoor athletes have adequate vitamin D, there's recent studies that show that our levels are similar to the general population. So geography, skin tone, time of year, and amount of skin exposed all affect synthesis. So I think since I am, like, typically I am a little bit darker skinned, like I have a more olive complexion to my skin, that affects my vitamin D synthesis. So yes, I do have a vitamin D deficiency that I've had for decades, like definitely over a decade, maybe multiple decades at this point. I was, probably since my 20s. I do take a vitamin D supplement. All right. So where are we at? You take one. I don't take one. Yeah. This may have some benefits. get a blood test to see where your vitamin D is. I think it's worth testing. Yeah. I think that if you have a vitamin D deficiency, then it's worth taking a supplement for. and you can get that from a very basic blood test. All right. Magnesium will be the next one. So magnesium is fundamental in muscle function, ATP production, electrolyte balance, bone strength, and cardiovascular health, and there's some p- some sh- research shows that athletes may have higher magnesium needs than sedentary individuals. if it's helping in muscle function, ATP, and- Yeah electrolyte balance, that all are things that athletes are going to need. I've heard of magnesium as one of the, not like the most critical, but one of the electrolytes that you need to take in, especially if you're out there for a very long time. Yeah. Because I start researching stuff that I might wanna consider for being out there- for hour upon hour. Magnesium's always on the list. And that's one of the, that's consistent with this 2025 meta-analysis that found that supplet- supplementation produced the strongest benefits in people that trained at higher volumes. So if you are doing a lot of high volume training, magnesium supplementation may be, more beneficial for you or if you have a low nutrient status. So if you start with a deficiency, it's going to be important for you to take magnesium. However, there is some e- evidence out there that shows that magnesium is involved in sleep res- regulation and nervous system dysfunction. So this is like a lot of times when people have muscle cramping You'll hear, people recommend magnesium supplementation, for muscle cramping or for re-restless leg syndromes or those kinds of things. so magnesium supplementation can be helpful for those things. there's multiple forms of magnesium. Magnesium glycinate tends to have fewer GI side effects than other forms, and there's also topical, forms of magnesium that you can use in, various creams or gels or sprays that won't have any GI side effects. So that can be helpful, too, if you have muscle cramping or restless legs or things like that. As you say, are those all designed towards cramping? Yes. which is funny 'cause, the research on what causes cramps, all the research out there will tell you it has nothing to do with your electrolytes. But all of the stu- like, anybody that you've talked to who's got any sort of history in- in coaching or racing or training at any sort of level is always like- Yeah "I cramped, I took these salts-" and I felt better." Yeah, or pickle juice. That's one of the reasons that people- Oh, yeah talk about pickle juice and mustard- Yeah during, for muscle cramping. the pucker response. Yeah. magnesium can be a helpful supplement to take. again, there, there is some pretty decent research, behind this, just limited in the athlete population- All that we are looking at. Excellent. Again, I don't take that one. I do sometimes. the thing with magnesium is that you have to be careful with the GI stuff, right? Because it can be used as a laxative. So if you over, if you take too much magnesium, then you might have some loose stools. But- That would be an unwanted side effect you sometimes take it if your legs are acting up on you and you're- I do having trouble sleeping. I, so I take a supplement called Natural Calm. Again, no affiliate link. That sh- I buy it at Costco. I like to have it at night. God, we should get a Costco affiliate link. That would be great. We would crush that. I don't think Costco even does affiliates 'cause I- Oh, they definitely don't. the... It was interesting. I actually read a, an article in Costco Magazine Okay, now it sounds like a commercial. That was talking about... I know, right? That was talking about all of the Costco influencers out there on social media, 'cause there's literally people that build their entire account around Costco and, showing the Costco deals and whatnot. And Costco doesn't, reimburse any of those people. So I'm curious, you know- Interesting how they make money, but Anywho, so yeah. So magnesium, can be a good thing. I to drink it at night. It's like a nice way for my body to wind down because it can be helpful for nervous system regulation, which, nervous system regulation, stress, like those, all of those pieces, you guys know those are big things that we talk about, especially if you are one of our clients. That's one of our main pillars that we coach on, which is nervous system regulation. So anything that's going to help your nervous system calm down and promote that sense of calm and relieve- and stress relief is going to help you pr- e- your performance indirectly. Yes. And if there's some research on it that's helpful- Yeah and if it just helps you feel more calm because it says calm on the box, it's not all that expensive of a thing that you're taking. No, it really wasn't. So it was worth it for me. To me, the cost benefit is, is- It's always a cost benefit. Yes. For sure. All right. Omega-3s, so EPA and DH- DHA are the two forms that we're looking at. I- are these fish fats? They are. And so I first learned about these 'cause they were in my prenatal vitamin. I remember that when I was looking and researching prenatals, that was one of the things that they said was important for me to find, is making sure that there was omega-3s EPA and DHA in that prenatal vitamin because it's very important for brain health, especially for a developing fetus. So omega-3s in general, they're, they have very well-established anti-inflammatory properties, and there is emerging evidence that is showing that they may support muscle growth, endurance capacity, and reduce muscle soreness after exercise. Again, these are up-and-coming studies. There's not, fantastic research around those claims yet. But they, they- But we do have good research on the anti-inflammatory we, yes. We have good research showing that they are anti-inflammatory. so if you just take that- it's a solid anti-inflammatory that's not an NSAID. because when you look at the most solid research for omega-3s is in cardiovascular and cognitive health, right? And so I think that it's important for us to just know, we're human beings also, right? Like it's not, we're not just runners. So there are beneficial, studies or there's research showing benefits in those areas. But the, in running performance specifically, we don't really have that yet. Did I start taking f- fish fat after, like in 2017 after I had seizures? I think so. I feel like I did for a little bit. I think that's one of the ones that I told you needed to take. Yeah. Yeah. And then I think eventually I got to a doctor, and they were like, "It doesn't seem to have a huge-" implications? Yeah. And so if you're already eating f- especially if you eat a lot of fish, right? so if you're already eating fatty fish, like two to three times per week, salmon is the big one that comes up there, supplementation may add a limited additional benefit. So if you're eating a lot of fish already, this may or may not be helpful for you. All right, I think we covered that guy. What do we got? collagen and vitamin C. Okay, so- Collagen and vitamin C? It's a combo. It's a lot of times it is a combo. Okay. so there is research that shows that collagen combined with vitamin C taken 30 to 60 minutes before training may support tendon and ligament health by support, by providing that the raw materials necessary when your connective tissue is being mechanically loaded. Okay, so theoretically- Theoretically collagen helps Like collagen is needed- so- to make connective tissues 'cause that's, collagen is the main building of, bu- block of cartilage. All right. So there's- So we need co- collagen in our connective tissues. But we'll say overall, there's a lot of people taking collagen, and collagen is coming out as like a protein source for a lot of people as well. And so I will tell you guys that the honest takeaway, I used to use collagen. I don't typically use it anymore because I don't feel like it's the best, use of my money. I th- I thought of it as a protein supplement. I thought, if it has benefits for my hair and my nails and my skin or my connective tissue, fantastic. But I was like, really, do I wanna be spending money on this or would I rather just buy a better protein supplement or would I rather just use that money somewhere else? so that was my honest takeaway is that there's really not a lot of great research on it. This is the supplement on this list with the least amount of established good evidence. so the mechanism that we talk about, it's plausible, right? So there's a lot of kind of l- we, this may work. The research is promising, but the studies are typically very small and short and not yet conclusive. So the good news is that there's really no negative effect of taking collagen other than financially. I was gonna say, other than your bank account. Yeah, other than your bank account. So there's no negative side effects of it. So in all of the research that I've seen and all of the scientists that I follow that I very much trust their opinion, that's the sen- the consensus is, it's not bad for you and it could possibly have some benefits. So if you wanna spend your money on it, go for it. All right. But your takeaway was something that we didn't even touch on this thing, and I wanna just cover it as quick as possible here. It might be more beneficial to simply make sure that you're getting in enough protein. And a protein supplement, a protein powder- Yeah might be useful to make sure that you actually have enough f- like basic fundamental fuel like carbs and protein. We talked about carbs right at the beginning. You gotta make sure you have enough protein in your body also so that you can actually just do all the things that your body wants to do to function. Yeah, for sure. But we have to be careful because collagen is not the high quality protein that people think it is. and it, but it is cheap and so it is being put into a lot of protein supplements, especially like protein bars or protein drinks, a lot of these clear protein drinks that you're seeing out there. Ah, interesting. Yeah. People are using collagen protein, but collagen protein is not a high source or high quality protein. So if you are taking a protein supplement, you would be much better off taking whey protein or some sort of plant-based protein like pea protein, brown rice protein, something like that. pea protein is typically the highest quality plant protein. the protein supplement that we like to take is a brand called Orgain and they use, pea protein, brown rice protein, and something else. I wanna think, I think quinoa maybe. I for- there's a couple different sources of protein that they use in there. but getting, just getting a high quality grass-fed whey supplement is going to be much better for protein needs than collagen. It's gonna be a little bit more expensive- but it's actually gonna be beneficial 'cause you have a- Yeah a complete protein coming at you. because collagen is not a complete protein, so it's a lower quality protein than other sources out there. All right. So if you're gonna spend your money, if you're thinking that you're using collagen for protein, just buy a different protein supplement that's a higher quality. All right, I think that's a good takeaway on that one. If you have any questions, email Angie. don't talk to me. I don't know. I'm just making this stuff up. Yeah. So all right, so today we really talked about the three Cs: carbohydrates, creatine, and caffeine. And hopefully this was a helpful thing to help you understand, really where you wanna start. So carbs are the most evidence-supported performance nutrient for endurance athletes, and most recreational runners are under-dosing. Address this before anything else, okay? Creatine is the strongest and most specific supplement evidence for women over 40 doing resistance training. There are promising research on strength, cognition, and sleep, but research in that, in this population, in women over 40, in perimenopause and post-menopause, tends to be newer and smaller, and we are very much looking forward, because you know the research is coming on this group for sure- Yeah which is great. There's research on other populations. Yeah. like men- But- 'cause that's where all the research starts. And then eventually we actually do research on women. But it, the supplement is safe. It's been shown to be safe, and, it's consistent. the, we've gotten good, consistent, results from it in the research. and then caffeine is consistently supported for endurance performance, but we have to be careful because the individual response varies, and it's important to remember the sleep trade-off there as well. Yeah. Quite frankly, that's a fun one to play with. So keep in mind, everything that we talked about today is- These are all supplements e- except for carbohydrates. Carbohydrates is, I would say, that's a very foundational part of your nutrition, so that needs to be, in place first before you think about the importance of carbs during exercise, right? So today we talked about carbs during exercise, but you still need to make sure you're eating enough carbohydrates just in your normal diet, okay? So these supplements that we talked about today are supplements. You still need those foundational pieces of making sure that you are sleeping enough, fueling enough, getting progressive training, strength work, and recovery. and then when you have those things solid, these add-ons might, be valuable. All right. I think that's a- an excellent synopsis. So yeah, longer episode. That's why we needed both these episodes. I know. It's, it was a longer episode today, but hopefully it was helpful for you guys to start to see some of the things that could be good additions for you. And maybe if you're doing some of the other stuff, maybe you decide to save some money and put it elsewhere. spend your money on something that's a little bit more beneficial. Yeah, that's gonna help increase the foundational pieces. Yeah, exactly. So if you guys have any questions, I'd love to hear any comments, so reach out on any of our platforms and, let me know your thoughts. And as always, thanks for joining us. If this was helpful, please leave us a review, send it to a friend. this has been the Real Life Runners podcast, episode number 465. Now get out there and run your life.