Real Life Runners with Angie and Kevin Brown

407: The Identity Shift Required for Running After 40

• Angie Brown

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This week, we’re diving deeper—not just into outdated strategies that no longer serve us as runners over 40, but into the powerful role identity plays in our running journey.

As runners, we can define ourselves by pace, distance, or race goals. But over time, that performance-based mindset can start to feel limiting—or even discouraging. In this episode, we talk about what it means to step into a new identity: one that prioritizes long-term health, strength, and the joy of movement.

Angie and Kevin both share their own evolutions as runners, and together we offer practical tips for embracing the identity of a lifelong runner—someone who listens to their body, trains smarter, and finds meaning beyond the stopwatch. We also unpack the power of language and self-belief, and how the words we use can either reinforce old habits or help us create new ones.

If you're navigating this transition too, we invite you to reevaluate how you see yourself as a runner and align your strategies with where you are now—and where you want to go.

And don’t forget—we’ve got a free five-day running challenge starting May 12th! We’d love for you to join us.


00:58 Aging and Running: Embracing Change

01:42 Outdated Strategies and New Approaches

03:20 The Importance of Identity in Running

04:10 Personal Running Journeys

06:23 Redefining What It Means to Be a Runner

07:43 The Power of Self-Identity

12:20 Words and Identity: The Impact on Performance

19:40 Evolving as a Runner: New Identities and Strategies

24:19 Embracing the Concept of Training

25:53 Shifting from Running to Training

28:24 Training with Wisdom and Recovery

30:35 The Importance of Identity in Running

37:36 Evolving as a Lifelong Runner


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Angie:

Welcome to the Real Life Runners podcast, episode number 407. Today we're continuing our conversation about why running is starting to feel different if you're a runner over 40, not only just because you're using outdated strategies, but today we're taking it one level deeper because if you don't change this one thing that we talk about today, there's no way that you're going to get the results that you're wanting. So if that sounds interesting, stay tuned. what's up runners? Welcome back to the show today. Kevin's with me. Hello Kev.

Kevin:

Hello, Angie.

Angie:

Hello, Angie. so today we're, continuing our conversation about running as we age, and this is one of those things that not a lot of people like to talk about, but this is one of those things that's literally happening every day. We are getting older, but you can change and you can. Determine how you experience aging as a runner from some of the things that we've been talking about over the past few weeks. And this is really just setting some of the stage. We've got some really exciting trainings coming up. Our five day challenge is coming back in May, so stay tuned for that. We're gonna be kicking that off May 12th. So mark your calendars and I'll let you know when registration is available for you to sign up for our five day running challenge. It's coming back and it's gonna be better than ever, but. Over the last few weeks here on the podcast, we've been talking about outdated strategies. So a couple episodes ago we were talking about those things about how our training and our nutrition need to change and shift as we get older because our body's changing and so our training needs to also, and the way that we are adapting. All of this is changing, right? Your body physiology is different after 40 than it was when you were in your twenties and your thirties. And so if you're still trying to do the same thing that you did, then even if it worked for you are probably noticing that things are different and you're not getting the same results,

Kevin:

which is super unfortunate because it'd be great if we could just keep doing the same thing for year upon year and just keep getting phenomenal results out of it. But that's just not the case. And fighting against it is what? That's a losing battle.

Angie:

It is. And then last week, if you haven't listened to last week's episode, I highly suggest you pause this, come back to it and go check out Cindy's story. Because Cindy is a perfect example of it's never too late to start. And as long as you do things in a way to honor your body, you can run for as long as you want and you can do all sorts of things that you previously thought were unattainable or n maybe never even on your radar as long as you are. Using the right strategy and honoring your body.

Kevin:

Yeah. I'm only partway into that episode. I don't listen to the episodes where I have to hear my own voice.'cause I still, I can't stand it. Even though we've done 400 plus episodes, you

Angie:

really can't stand your voice.

Kevin:

No. Still can't. I know. Really. I know. We're this many episodes, we gotta work on that and all the playback, it still drives me nuts, but listening to just, I'm only a little bit in,'cause I, I. My run ended today. but it's such a good episode. You guys have to go back and if you've missed it, go back and check out 4 0 6. 4 0 6. That is such a good episode.

Angie:

Yes. And so today we're going one level deeper because you guys know we don't like to stay surface level around here. And we can talk about strategies, we can talk about training, we can talk about nutrition, we can talk about all of these things that are on that surface level, but. But underlying all of that, if we ignore the underlying layer, then those things, obviously, like you might start to see some results, but you might not get the full power of all of those results. And that thing that we're talking about is your identity. Your identity is how you see yourself and how you. See what's capable or what you're, what you are capable of, like what you believe you are capable of and what you think is possible for you. Because you can change your plan, you can change your workouts and your nutrition, but if your identity doesn't shift, there's, you're always gonna be leaving something on the table. And I know about this because I did not use to think of myself as a runner. When I first started running, it was simply to lose weight and get in shape, and I was an athlete my whole life growing up playing different sports and running was always punishment and runners were always crazy'cause I couldn't understand how someone would actually, genuinely enjoy. I. Just going out to run because especially if there was no ball involved, you're over here laughing. I,

Kevin:

I, because I got into running for literally the opposite of that. Yeah. Like I, I got into running because there, that's weird. There were weird people who wanted to just go run and there wasn't a ball involved. I

Angie:

know. It's the strangest thing to me. When I first started running, it was just a means to an end. It was I wanted to have quote unquote, the body of a runner, and I thought running was going to give that to me. And then I met this crazy man standing next to me and he liked running just for running, and I did not understand that, but he was cute and he had dimples. So I was like, okay, let me check this out and see if this is something I could get into a little bit, especially if it's something that can help me stay in shape because I'm no longer a part of. An organized sports team. And so for the longest time when I was still out there running, I still would not call myself a runner. Yes, I ran, I did five Ks, I did other things, but I didn't think of myself as a runner. And I'm trying to think back and think what, how I qualified my definition of a runner and why I didn't say that I was one. And I'm not super clear on it because it was a very long time ago, but I think that. In some ways I felt like I had to earn that title from a pace or a distance. And because I always saw Kevin as a runner and Kevin was much faster than me, he enjoyed running more than I did and would go out and run much longer than I did. So I was like, I'm none of those things, so I must not be a runner. And I don't think that this was on a conscious level. I think all of that was on a very subconscious level.

Kevin:

Yeah, I'm sure that there was some comparison to me and that was probably holding back your. Original adoption of I'm a runner because I was out there doing, longer distances and faster paces. And so it's hard to not have that immediate comparison. Yeah.'cause I helped spur you into the whole running thing also.

Angie:

Yeah. I think that one of my main shifts I. Really came when I started to see running as a skill that could be improved because for a long time I didn't think that I was a runner because I thought you almost had to be born a runner. Like you're either good at running or you're not good at running. And I put myself as not good at running, so therefore I'm not a runner. Where I looked at people like you and saw how easily running seemed to come for you, like you could just go off and you loved it and you were good at it and it. That was never how I experienced running. So maybe that's how I was defining running was not only are you good at it, but you also enjoy it. And those are two things that I never. Considered myself, considered true for me.

Kevin:

by the time you met me as a runner, I had already gone through a whole running identity transformation myself. Oh

Angie:

really?

Kevin:

'cause I had, I ran in high school. I was pretty good in high school. I walked on in college. I was nowhere near as good as the people that I was running with. I stopped running for a few months. And then I had to figure out how I wanted to run, but not be part of an organized team, but still running. Oh yeah. Like you flipped from being like a ball sport athlete and then Running was gonna be like a thing that you were doing, but you were also doing like intermural sports and other things like that. Yeah. Like you still had other athletic ventures. I had to figure out how to run. On my own, and that took a whole identity overhaul myself.

Angie:

yeah. So we've both been through this. Yeah. And I think that's really good because people listening you listeners can hopefully identify with either me or Kevin, because that's really what we are talking about today is how. After 40, we really have to start to shift our identity as a runner. And you are still a runner. And this is really an important thing that I want to hit home before we move forward, which is you are a runner if you run and if you choose to take on that title. And that's what one of the things that I realized is that I didn't have to. Hit a certain time or hit a certain distance. Becoming a runner was simply a choice to call myself one. And once I made that choice to become a runner and to call myself a runner, I then started acting a lot more like a runner. And I'm like, if I'm gonna be a runner, if I'm gonna call myself a runner, then there's certain things that I have to do because in my mind, there's certain things that runners do and they go out and run and they try to get better and they try to get faster. And once I started to number one, see running as a. Skill that could be improved. And then number two, actually call myself a runner Then. I was able to start making all of these improvements that I never would've imagined possible for myself. And so if you're sitting there listening to this and you don't yet call yourself a runner, I would encourage you to start there. And I would encourage, or even one step back, which is understanding that running is a skill that can be improved. You're not born a runner or not a runner. You're not born a good runner or not a good runner. You get to just decide. You're gonna call yourself a runner and. Then when you choose that, you then start to do the things that runners do. So if you're thinking like, oh, I'm too slow to be a runner, or I walk sometimes, or I've never run a race, or I only do five Ks, or I don't look like a runner. There's all these different thoughts and beliefs that can make us believe that we're not a runner. And I think that this is a really big problem, and this is one of the conversations that Kevin and I were just having before we hit record. Was that if you don't even quite believe that you're a runner yet, you could still be trying to prove that you are by doing the things that you think real runners quote unquote do. Like pushing yourself really hard every day run, going out and running more and more miles like some of these mistakes are these. Old, outdated training strategies that we've talked about in past episodes that we'll touch on a little bit today, but over training, pushing through pain, under fueling yourself, restricting calories. if you think that's what runners do and you're still trying to prove to yourself that you're a runner, it's going to be very easy to continue to fall into those traps.

Kevin:

a hundred percent. Let's go. Like step by step down these thoughts. Do you have, I'm too slow. So that means you're gonna go out and just push yourself way too hard on all of your runs. That's gonna be an issue. I walk sometimes. Maybe that's what you need to do to bring your heart rate back down, to turn an easy run into an easy run. So if you're like, ah, if I walk ever during my run, then I'm not really a runner, so I just, I can't. Walk ever. So now you're over training that thing. I've never run a race. Great. Signing up for race after race, but never actually giving yourself time to train properly from the race. Yeah, that's gonna lead to a whole lot of disappointing race results. if you have these thoughts and then you try to fight back and really just push hard against them, it's setting you up for not a great experience and then not getting necessarily the results that you want off of this. So even though you're really pushing and fighting for the, the opposite of these phrases. You are, you're using poor strategies to try and get it. And you can just simply say, I'm a runner because I'm going out and running. I am a runner. I run, therefore I'm a runner. And that's all you need.

Angie:

And so that's step one is to really claim that identity, which most of you. Can do right now without having to prove or earn anything. And then once you claim that identity, the question then becomes, what kind of a runner do I want to be now? So this next part applies to all of you, whether or not you already think of yourself as a runner or whether or not that last conversation made you slightly uncomfortable because you're realizing that you don't think of yourself as a runner. Choose right now to call yourself a runner because then the rest of this conversation today will apply to you because now you get to decide, now that I am a runner, or those of you that have been runners for 10, 20, 30 years, you still get to decide today what kind of a runner am I going to be moving forward? And this is where we really want you to start leaning into this identity of real life runner or lifelong runner because your identity. Influences your decisions. And this is why this is so important. This is why we're going to go deeper on this and really hit home.'cause some people think to themselves, this is just semantics. Like it doesn't really matter what I call yours, what I call myself, but it definitely does because your identity, who you believe yourself to be. Influences your decisions on training or running or taking a rest day. It influences your self-talk. We all know that we have both positive and negative ways that we talk to ourselves. And who you believe yourself to be and what you believe yourself to be capable of is going to influence that level of self-talk. It's going to influence what kind of goals you set for yourself. Whether you give yourself permission to try new things and to fail and to keep going, or if you just choose to see yourself as a failure and then quit. All of these things are influenced by your identity.

Kevin:

I mean your identity. People that suggest that it's semantics. here's a setup for you. Try and visualize this. Your boss walks in'cause I, I'm. Good friends with my boss also, I think if he is gonna have a conversation with me and he opens it with Kevin, we need to talk. That's a very different immediate feeling that I go to than, Hey Kev, can I talk to you? And he has called me by both things, depending on the particular conversation that we are about to have. And one of them is much more lighthearted, And it is. These that is my name. And our name is so core to our identity, but having conversations that opens with Kevin, can we have a conversation versus, Hey Kev, can we talk? Is so it's semantics. Yeah. It's two letters it's in. That's all it is. But you can see that the difference between the name someone calls you is so critical. So this is why the names that we call ourselves. Runner, not a runner. Whatever adjective you wanna throw in front of runner once you've fully adopted that you're a runner is super critical to every, all of the actions and decisions that you're making following that.

Angie:

Absolutely. And I love that you point that out because I think that a lot of people can relate to that. if you have a nickname, like my nickname is Angie, and I've been Angie basically my entire life. I actually had this conversation with my mom the other day because she was over here. And, for, if you haven't been following me on Instagram, I have been put. Haven't been posting about it as much recently. I need to post more about it because I just absolutely love that. My mom comes over three days a week to work out with me now, because for the longest time, we're talking years, I've tried to get my mom to start working out. On a regular basis. And finally I just said to her, mom, just come over to my house. Come over to my house Monday, 10:00 AM 11:00 AM whatever time it was, and we'll just, we'll do a workout together. We'll both work out. I'll be there for you. I'll instruct you, I'll, help you modify whatever is going on. And we've been doing it this way for a couple of months now, which has been so fantastic. And so anyway, my mom was at my house the other day and I asked her. When did you start calling me Angie? Because for a long time she actually just brought over this box. this is what kind of spurred this conversation. So my mom brought over a box last week of old pictures'cause she was going through pictures and stuff in her, the one closet of her house and found all of these old pictures. And so she separated all these pictures into piles, like one for me, one for my sister. And so she brought over all the photos of me and I was looking through these photos and inside of that box also was a baby book like. The My Baby's first milestones and I was slipping through that and she referred to me as Angela in all of those things, and she was writing about my first Christmas and all of these things, and how wonderful it is to have Angela here, and I haven't gone by Angela. I don't even know how long since I was little and I don't remember really people calling me that ever. And so I asked her, when did I. Become Angie and she said pretty early on in life. And I said, okay. I wasn't sure if it was like, when I actually had a say, did I ask to be called Angie? And then people started calling me that, or was it sooner than that? She said, no, it was earlier than that. And I. So I know how it feels, and if you have a nickname, you probably know this feeling as well. If someone calls you by your formal name of Angela, there's this disconnect that happens and I'm like, you either don't know me at all, or you definitely don't know me well enough to know that I don't go by Angela. I go by Angie, and I've always been Angie. And then there's people that call me Anang also, which I love. But. That's this identity piece, of, immediately when someone calls you by a certain name, that means something. So if someone calls me, Angela, I know you don't know me very well at all, right? If someone calls me Angie, that means, okay, you clearly, you know me well, or maybe not, but you at least know enough to know my real name. To know what your name is, right? To know my name. Identity influences everything, and I think that's really important because your identity speaks to you on a subconscious level. It's not conscious. sometimes it is, but it also speaks to you on a very subconscious level.

Kevin:

Yeah. So if someone comes up and says, hey fast runner, do you immediately like wince at that? Because I've said it to people on our cross country and track team, I'm like, oh man, quite the fast runner today. And they're like, what are you kidding? Like they, they immediately push back over this. Some of them will say thank you, and it's a matter of like, how different does that phrase go with the identity that they've given themselves?

Angie:

So it's their own level of belief.

Kevin:

Yes. And so'cause I look at a bunch of people and it's look, you're pretty fast. You go out. you see these things, I dunno, for some reason in the last few weeks, they're, they've hit my feet on all the different social medias of what is an average 5K time and an average marathon time, like worldwide right now. And it's oh, maybe you're faster than you think you are. Or maybe you're closure to average than you think you are. And it's, they're interesting things to go out there. But when you go up and tell somebody who doesn't necessarily categorize themselves as a fast runner, and you're like, Hey, looking really fast today. It's very interesting to see the response that people get. Because once you start classifying yourself in different categories within runner, that leads to different decision making, different actions.

Angie:

And isn't it interesting too, that you could go up and say that to somebody and you could intend it to be. A compliment. And if they don't have that level of belief in themselves, they could completely see that as an insult. Yeah. As you making fun of them. Yes. Like really like that, that's sarcasm.

Kevin:

Yeah. and this is why I'm doing my best to try to avoid sarcasm, which is a lifelong process. It is,

Angie:

it is. And, but it's. All goes back to who that person believes themselves to be. Like your sentence and the words that you say could be the same, but the way that they interpret it is different based on their own level of identity and their own level of self-belief in that statement.

Kevin:

Yeah. Which is why words matter, but so does your own identity because your identity is going to affect how you hear the words that you're saying to yourself and the words that other people are saying to you.

Angie:

So if you are still operating. As a runner who believes that more is better, that thinner is better, that in order for me to get better as a runner, I just have to push harder and I'll just keep pushing hard. I'll rest later or I'll skip rest. Then you are operating from that outdated identity because things like that did work in your twenties and thirties like, and it. It depends on who you are and your level of experience and all sorts of different factors, but at some point those things stop working and those are some of the things that we've been talking about over the past few weeks. And all of those things go back to the identity of runner, either the one that you've already accepted for yourself or your belief. What a runner should be, or who a runner is, or what a runner should be doing, because we all have a different definition of what a runner is or what a good runner is, and that's really what we're asking you to start to question today and start to look at a little bit differently when it comes to. Your old runner identity or your old identity of maybe not a runner to the new identity that you would like to step into. And we're gonna give you guys a couple options and examples of this. And I would love for you to also come up with your own as you listen to this podcast and as you reflect on it afterwards. To say, okay, how am I identifying and how am I possibly operating from an old identity that is no longer serving me?

Kevin:

Yeah. I like the, the metaphor that you got here. you said that trying to create new results from an outdated identity is like trying to pr in shoes that don't fit anymore. I'd like to suggest that it might also be like trying to pr in shoes that don't have a carbon plate sometimes. Sometimes things evolve and you have to join the evolution or you're just not going to be able to produce at the same level anymore.

Angie:

So you and I were just having this conversation last week when I was looking at the Brooks website Yes. At my shoes, and we were looking at different racing shoes, and you made that comment about racing flats and how you used. To race.

Kevin:

There's not even a term called racing flats anymore. Like Racing flats used to be so ridiculously thin. Underneath. Yeah, because the foam was one of the heavier parts of the shoe. Like you just try to make the shoes as light as possible in order to do it. They were just, they were hard to run on. They took out a bunch of the foam,'cause it made it lighter, and so they called them flats because they look like your normal running shoes, but shorter and now. Racing shoes. There are shoes out there that are, that pros can't race in that you and I could go out and buy, but they're illegal to try and go out and set a record. And they're illegal to go out and try and win prize money in because the stack site stack height is too high on them.'cause it's just how much springy foam can we put underneath? And if we have the plate at the right angle, then we need to mask it with enough squishy foam around it that you're, you. Aren't just in pain as you run the whole thing. Yeah, it's, yeah. And that your Achilles doesn't just blow up on you. that's a different conversation about shoes, but let's not dive into that one too much planter

Angie:

fascia as well. So let's go over some possible old identities and then the new runner identity. That you can choose to step into. Because remember, your identity is a collection of your thoughts, your actions, your slash behaviors, and then the results that you have. Because all of the results that you have in your life stems from the actions that you take, and your actions come from the thoughts and the beliefs that you have about yourself, which all come from your identity. So we're Moving this one step backwards, we, that's what we've been doing over the past couple of weeks. we've talked about the results, we've talked about, the actions and the behaviors. Now we're taking it that step back further to really get, dig into some of those thoughts and beliefs and then possibly the identity behind those. So if you have the idea of, I have to. Earn the title of runner, then you might be going out ask yourself, okay, if I believe that's true, what will that lead me to do? What kind of actions, if I believe I have to earn this will I do? So a lot of runners, if they believe this, and I know this is one of the things that I believed when I was. When I believed I wasn't a runner was that I just needed to go out and push harder because obviously pushing harder was going to make me faster, and then if I was faster, then maybe I could call myself a runner or maybe people would see me that way.

Kevin:

So then you've connected to earning the title based off of a. A number on a clock somewhere. Which is a lot of what this is earning the title is a number on a clock or the distance of a race that you've signed up to run. Or how long is your longest training run? People put a number to this thing. And in order to get to whatever that is, you have to push real hard to get to it. Yeah. And often it leads to, I have to push all the time to get to it as fast as possible.'cause I really would like to earn that title. Yeah. Because we want it now. Yes, we do. So I'm going to go out and grind day upon day. And will you. You grind yourself into powder.

Angie:

And what if instead, like, how would your actions be different if you decided I don't have to earn the title, I just choose to own it right now. And in choosing this title for myself, in choosing to call myself a runner, a real life runner, a lifelong runner, that means that I go out and I train every day. And I would love to talk a little bit too, a little on a side note about the word training because I was. Talking to a friend of mine the other day and she was asking me, do your, the people that you're trying to reach and the people that you're trying to help, do they really call it training or do they just call it running? And I'm like, oh, that's a really good point. Ooh, good one. I love that idea. And so as a little side note, you don't have to be training for a race. In order to call what you're doing training. I like to call it training because we are all working towards a goal. So yes, you can just go out and run and if you're not working towards any sort of goal, running would probably be a good word for it. But if you are trying to work towards some goal, I love to call it training, and I would love to invite you to start calling it training because when you start calling it training, you think of yourself more as a runner and as an athlete, all of a sudden, not only. Do I go out and run, but now I'm training for something. And again, it doesn't have to be a race. It can be, I just want to feel better on my runs. I just wanna be able to run a little bit longer. I wanna be able to walk less when I go out and run. All of those are goals that you're working toward, towards, and all of those are very. Worthwhile and valid goals that make you a runner because you're using running as a tool to help you gain something in your life, whether it's strength or better health, or a PR or a new distance, or breaking down and challenging yourself. Like breaking down an old belief of I never thought I could do this, and now I'm challenging myself to be able to do this thing. You're training for something. And so using the word training is a very powerful shift and yes. It's semantics, but you can see how when we make that shift and start using different words, that allows us to start thinking about ourselves differently.

Kevin:

Yeah. I'm gonna move to your next one and then continue on this whole training versus running idea.'cause it goes right with the next one. Your outdated identity of I push through pain versus a newer identity of I train with wisdom and recovery. You didn't say a run. With wisdom and recovery. I trained, I didn't go for a run yesterday, but that is part of my training. I literally planned to not have a run yesterday as part of an overall training program. Yes. Not my running program, but my training program, yes. Included that as an off day. Like I did not have a huge amount of physical activity yesterday outside of a very vigorous egg hunt. but

Angie:

And cornhole game.

Kevin:

And a cornhole game. Yeah. I know. I. I had to limber up before that one and get my shoulder ready for it. but it's a whole different story. but it's a training involves all of your activities, whereas you say, oh, running is just this small portion of a day. And if you're not going for a run every day, and even at the highest level, I would say suggest taking an off day once a week that. Training can still happen on that day. Training happens throughout the day. Training is not just this small window where you lace up your shoes.

Angie:

And that connects back to what we were saying before about how you don't have to earn it. Because if you think that once you hit a certain distance or a certain time or some certain number, that in your head means that you're a runner. You don't acknowledge the whole process that it took to get there. And by calling yourself a runner, now at the beginning, you then can start to acknowledge the process as the way for you to achieve the goal. And it's going through that process of, that's what actually makes you into a runner. It's going out for your runs several times per week. It's putting in the strength training and the mobility and the rest, and the recovery days and training in a way. For your body to adapt and get stronger. And if you just say, I'm not a runner until I hit that number, then it completely ignores the entire process that was required for you to get there, which is actually when you became a runner overall.

Kevin:

Sure. Yeah. do you see what

Angie:

I'm saying? Yeah.

Kevin:

you've, you are a runner'cause you adopt the identity. But then once you're doing, but you still

Angie:

have to do things to re you still do

Kevin:

things to

Angie:

reinforce the identity. Just get

Kevin:

in a shirt that says I'm a runner. Doesn't count if you're sitting on the couch every day.

Angie:

Correct. Like

Kevin:

that. that's just a shirt.

Angie:

Exactly. Like you can choose to be whoever you are, but then. After you choose your identity, you then have to do the actions that reinforce that identity.'cause it's a loop,

Kevin:

right? Otherwise you get this weird disconnect and you feel awkward. But training with wisdom is also a good one. This one I get up against when I'm training the high school kids all the time because they've got a lot of energy on some days. Some days they're exhausted because they have three tests in a day, but sometimes they have a lot of energy. And I'm like, all Here's our workout for the day and we're doing eight reps of whatever the distance is, and they finish it and they're like, I'm not that tired. Should we do a couple more? I'm like, no, you're good. And there's a wisdom involved in knowing that you don't have to push yourself. To a breaking point. Yeah. Even on a hard day, like a hard day doesn't mean that you finish, it collapsed on the ground. that's not necessarily what you need. There is time where you should push yourself. You should try and stretch yourself a little bit. pushing through pain is fine on occasion. It's not a day in mantra that you should adopt every single time. There needs to be a balance to your training. That's where the wisdom and the experience comes in. And listening to some guidance along the way and being like, all right, this is a day that I want to have a little bit still left over at the end of it, it's still a good workout. I'm still getting benefits from this, but I'm gonna be able to come back and maintain the consistency for the next day and the next day, and the next day. I.

Angie:

And so that's really then taking that long-term view over what's possible for you as well, and understanding that I'm not there yet. And in order for me to get there, I have to meet myself where I am, and I have to train in a way that's very smart so that some days I can just go easy and then other days I can push myself a little bit harder because pushing outside of your comfort zone. Is what is going to help you get to the next level, but not if you ignore recovery and not if you just keep pushing every single day. Because people hear this idea of, you have to get outside your comfort zone and you have to push beyond what you're currently capable of if you want to improve. And that's true. A little bit of the time. Not every single time that you go out for a run, not every single time you go to the gym. If you go to the gym and you try to lift heavy and you try to PR on every single time you lift, you are going to be injured in a couple of weeks, maybe even by the end of that week. it depends on how much you're really doing there, but like these are some of those outdated strategies that again, come from that underlying identity of. I'm not a runner yet, or I need to prove it, or I'm a slow runner, or those types of things. changing from this idea of, I only, it only counts if I'm fast or I'm only a runner if I'm fast or I'm not worthwhile unless I'm fast. I know that kind of. Sounds a little bit farfetched, but we might not say it that way to our, to ourselves and our heads, but we can be thinking that on a subconscious level. So instead of just thinking about speed, you wanna jump in here?

Kevin:

Sometimes we do say that out loud. Yeah. It's like sometimes that transition happens. that happened to me. when I was around 20. Yeah. Of, I'm not a runner'cause I'm not fast. it often had the word enough thrown on the end of it. Yeah. but I wasn't, but I think

Angie:

that's what good. Because not everyone says fast. Just say fast enough.

Kevin:

Yeah.

Angie:

I'm not fast enough to keep up with those guys.

Kevin:

Suggesting that there's some barrier, there's some number on, again, there's some number on a clock that determines who counts and who doesn't count. Yeah. And, especially as runners are moving into their forties, fifties, there's a number on a clock that might be harder to hit than it was in your twenties and thirties. And so if at any point in time you've got that idea of, maybe you fully embraced, I'm a runner now because you hit whatever that num arbitrary number was that you're like, oh, I did get fast enough. I'm a runner, but now that number seems to be slipping away. Yeah. That's a tricky identity. That's a real tough one, because maybe you literally did overcome this number you made. Yeah. And you said, I did it. I can now call myself a runner. But what if you don't have that number anymore?

Angie:

because. Ultimately it's going to slip away at some point. At some point, right? Like it's just a matter of when, there is going to be a point in every runner's journey that they start, that they get slower instead of faster, and that there is going to be a time where you hit your last PR in that distance. And no, none of us know when that actually is, which is the freaky part of it all. It's like the last time, like me as a mom and having teenage daughters right now, I have a 15-year-old and a 12-year-old. I think back, and you never know when it's the last time that you're going to give them a bath, for example, or the last time that you're going to strap them into a car seat. there's just certain things and certain milestones that just happen along the way that you don't realize that's the last time you're going to do that thing. And it's really hard later when you do realize that. But that's why it's important for us to value every single day in every single moment, in every single race, which is really. That consistency and the energy that you're putting into your running and your training and your identity as a runner or even just as a healthy person. I think that's a big part of it too, whether you call yourself a runner or not. Hopefully, after listening to this episode, every single person will raise their hand when asked if they're runners, but. Maybe you really identify as a healthy person or you want to be a healthy person. You have to start calling yourself that now in order for you to do the things that are going to then reinforce that identity. Like going back to the reason that I started running, I ran to burn calories. It was simply a numbers game. It was calories in, calories out. I ran to burn more calories and The reason that I wanted to run longer was so that I could burn more calories. And the reason that I wanted to push harder and run faster was because then I could burn more calories in less time. And that was my whole mindset, like I really didn't care how long I ran. other than that. Number in the calorie box because then that meant that, not that I could eat more, but that, I could create this calorie deficit so that I could lose weight, which ultimately ended up backfiring, didn't really work anyways. And that's what a lot of runners in this phase of life are finding as well, is that if you're continuing to operate by that idea of I'm running to burn calories, or I'm running to burn off my food, your metabolism starts to shift after the age of 40 because of all the way that. The ways that your hormones are shifting. It changes how your body uses glucose and uses insulin and your cortisol levels, like all of the hormones are changing. And so if you just keep thinking about restricting calories and burning more calories, it's going to start backfiring. And I've been talking to so many women. Who are still operating with this idea of I exercise to burn calories and then I restrict my food so that my numbers and my balance is correct, and they are just continuing to gain weight. They have no energy. They're cranky, they're moody, and they just feel awful. They have no energy for anything and it's because their body's not being nourished and supported. And so the, your body just doesn't have not only what it needs. To get better, but just to even maintain where you are right now. And so a lot of women start declining in this phase of life because they're still stuck in this calorie burn mindset.

Kevin:

Alright, Instead of I run to burn calories. What mindset are you taking on That's a better frame off of that one. Something connected more towards healthy.

Angie:

Yes, and strong. Like I now value myself as a strong person, as a strong runner. Like I run to get stronger and I use running as really, I. A part of my overall health plan. So my whole goal is to stay strong and actually to get stronger. I'm not just trying to maintain at this point in my life, I'm trying to actually build strength and build endurance, and it's also just a way for me to feel more alive and more connected and to move my body and to honor my body and to really. Celebrate what my body's able to do. And so instead of just thinking about burning calories, I am seen running as a way that I can continue to get stronger, both mentally and physically.

Kevin:

that's a much healthier approach towards, health, shall we say.

Angie:

Yeah. and it also allows me to. on those days to honor my body where I need rest today. I, because I know that if I go out and I push myself, I'm really just gonna be breaking my body down even more and leaving my body even more depleted, which is going to affect me negatively in the long run.

Kevin:

they're all so connected that is the wisdom that you train with. Instead of pushing through pain, pushing through exhaustion, you train with the wisdom that helps maintain your value of consistency, that gives you the appropriate energy that then leads to health. It's interesting to me that you started getting into it to be healthier. Then you. You got so focused on the numbers, details. And then you kinda were like, let's ignore the number detail and just focus on the healthy aspect of it. Yeah. Like I got into running because I thought it was fun, and then I got so bogged down in numbers on a clock. Yeah. And then I stopped being so worried about numbers on a clock. I still find them interesting. I still like to keep track of them. I'm so much more focused on running for the fun aspect of it. It goes back to, I think it often goes back to where we came in. it's just a new evolution of that sort of framing that got us into running in the first place.

Angie:

I really love that idea that it's almost like a pendulum. Pendulum swinging, right? Like we started here, we swung over here for a while and now we're coming back, but we're doing it much more wise. Wiser and with more intention that we're bringing into it? Yes.

Kevin:

Far more intention.

Angie:

Yeah, because I think that's really what we can start to hang onto is as we get older and we start to embrace this identity of a lifelong runner or a real life runner, that's not something that fades with age. It doesn't matter if my times. Get slower because that's not what running is about for me anymore. yes, it's still fun to chase times. It's still fun to go out and do speed sessions and to go out and sign up for races and see where you are right now. And all of that is still fun and that, and if you love. Numbers, and you're a runner that likes the numbers. I'm not telling you to get rid of that, like by all means, but just decide what those numbers mean because we can attach whatever meaning to those numbers that we want. And so if you decide to take on this identity of a lifelong runner. It's using your running and your training as something that's going to help you to get stronger and to help you continue to grow as a person, to continue to help you stay stronger. just as a human and, That's never gonna go away.

Kevin:

Yeah. No, it's the lifelong healthy approach, which you've adopted for years now, and I think that it's a constantly evolving thing and sometimes you think that you've evolved past it. you pointed out that if you wanna stick with the numbers, you can hang on to some of these numbers, but just. Make sure that none of them have too sticky of a connection to your identity. Yeah. Like I know there's still numbers in my head that they're gonna pop up that I'm like, oh, I'm not sure if I can hit that number anymore and that might be an uncomfortable, day for me. Yeah. When that thing shows up.'cause I'm like, oh, I didn't think that number meant anything to me. But apparently it does. there's going to be. Times just because you're like, oh, no, I've evolved. I've got a more mature outlook on this thing. It's gonna be fine. There may still be things that show up sometimes, and that's okay. Yeah. Like it doesn't have to be perfect all the time. Sometimes new things come up and you're like, oh, I thought I'd moved past that part of my identity. Yeah. Apparently I'm going to face that right now. Yeah. Like it's gonna be all right.

Angie:

Yeah, because for a while for me, I would never have believed that I was able to run a half marathon, and then I did it and I became a half marathoner. And then I said, I wonder if I could be a sub two hour half marathoner. I wanted to be, have that identity, and that's very numbers based. You can't just decide you're gonna be, Like you, you can in a way, right? Because if you go by what we've been talking about in this episode, I had to decide that I was going to be, or that I was a two hour marathon or half marathoner. And then train in a way that a sub two hour half marathoner would train. She would get up early, she would fuel her body with good nutrition. She would strength train. Like these are the things that she would do. And that's really, that goes back to identity is a choice. We have to make that choice ahead of time. I had to start training that way in order for me to have a chance to get that result, which I then did. And then again, it's because, so then that result and the. reinforce the identity that I had already chosen for myself, which was sub two hour half marathoner.

Kevin:

But you didn't have to wait for that, that, race printout at the end of 1 50, 1 5, whatever the number is. Afterwards, you had to

Angie:

accept 1 58, 59. I know. I think was my fir was my break two hour. Yes. Yes, I was right there. Yes it was. Yeah.

Kevin:

but you didn't have to wait for that number. You didn't, even standing on the starting line. You didn't have to wait two hours Yeah. To be a sub two hour marathoner. You had taken on, you had adopted it, you had chosen that identity months prior and then put in the work to prove to yourself that identity was in fact Correct. And even if you came across the line two minutes later as a 2 0 1 half marathoner did that too.

Angie:

I hit that time also. It was after. Because, and that's the thing too, is that your identity can be fluid too. Yeah. and your results are also fluid. And I did run a sub two hour, half marathon, and then I came back and I ran a 2 0 1 after what? And I was like, wait a second. I thought I was, and like that was a different race and I was running that race for fun with friends in Napa. Not

Kevin:

a sub two hour, half marathoner.

Angie:

I know. But it is funny that way, and I think that does happen to a lot of people. It's like they hit that goal and then the next time they try it and they don't achieve that goal, now it's all of a sudden I'm questioning that thing. It's no, it's just. Didn't happen that day. Yeah. And that's

Kevin:

okay. and, but that's the thing. what if it doesn't happen the first time that you go for it and what doesn't happen? It didn't happen yet. Yeah. that's a thing. You can still have that identity even when the evidence in front of you seems to be suggesting the opposite. It's not there yet. Yeah. it's just a process that you're going to, which is why you always have to enjoy the process. if you're not actually enjoying the journey to being sub two hour on the half marathon Yeah. Then are you really gonna enjoy the number on the clock when you cross the finish line? that's the thing. Like you have to enjoy the steps along the way.

Angie:

Yeah. Because that's what makes you a runner in the first place, or that makes you whatever identity you wanna step into.

Kevin:

Yeah. A little weird. Weird.

Angie:

it is a different way of thinking, and that's really why we wanted to bring this podcast. To you all today to just start getting you thinking in this direction of oh, wait, what? Like I have to accept the identity first. I don't have to earn it. I just get to choose it. yes, it can be that simple, but then you still have to do the actions and the behaviors that person would do to then reinforce that identity. Because if you just choose an identity and then you don't do the things you're, there's, like Kevin said before, there's going to be a disconnect in your brain and. You're not gonna be able to hold onto that identity.

Kevin:

You either discard the identity or you have to start doing the actions. Which is why you have to so fully embrace the identity. Because then that disconnect makes you feel uncomfortable and you start doing the actions. Yeah. If you're like, ah, yeah, I identify with this thing, but then you don't do the actions and the discomfort comes up, you'll be like, eh, I guess I'm gonna discard that identity. And that can be real, real easy if you're only lightly holding onto the identity.

Angie:

Exactly. So I hope this was helpful. I would love to hear your feedback. So if you haven't left us a review yet, please go ahead and hit that five star review and leave us a little blurb of why you liked this episode or share it with a friend. and if this episode did resonate with you, I'd love for you to join our five day running challenge coming up. We start May 12th. the registration for that will open up the week before that. So we're talking like probably, it'll probably open up either somewhere between May. First and May 5th. so keep your eye out If you wanna get on our email list so that you can be the first to know when registration for that is open. You can go over to real life runners.com and just scroll down the page. There's a place where you can enter your email just so that you're on our mailing list, and we'll be informed when, all of our free trainings happen. because I do free trainings all the time, my goal is to get more of this information out into the world to help more people to understand that. There are different ways that you can choose to start looking at your running and looking at your training and different things that you can do to start feeling better and getting stronger. especially as we continue to get older because all of us that's happening every single day. so head over to real life runners.com, sign up for our email list. There. we also have a bunch of free resources and all sorts of fun stuff, for you on the website. And if you haven't started following us on Instagram yet, I would love for you to send me a DM over at Real Life Runners on Instagram, send me a d and tell me what you liked about this episode as well. And as always, thanks for spending this time with us. This has been The Real Life Runners podcast, episode number 407. Now get out there and run your life.