385: You Don't Need More Motivation. You Need This.

Today we are digging into the often misunderstood topic of motivation. We discuss why motivation, while potentially useful in the short term, is not the key to long-term success in running. Instead, they emphasize the importance of consistency and action, which build the necessary belief systems to achieve running goals. The episode highlights how small, manageable action steps can bolster motivation, create lasting habits, and ultimately transform identity. 

00:49 The Limitations of Motivation

01:15 Consistency Over Motivation

05:03 The Role of Small Steps

07:56 Belief and Action: The True Drivers

12:30 Transforming Identity Through Action

15:44 Setting Realistic Goals

35:18 The Importance of Enjoying the Journey

Thanks for Listening!!

Be sure to hit FOLLOW on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or your favorite podcast player

Leave a review on Apple Podcasts. Your ratings and reviews really help and we read each one!

Grab your free Strength Guide for Runners here.

Interested in our coaching program? Check out our coaching options here.

Grab your free copy of the Running Snapshot by clicking here.

Come find us on Instagram and say hi!

Don't forget: The information on this website is not intended to treat or diagnose any medical condition or to provide medical advice. It is intended for general education in the areas of health and wellness. All information contained in this site is intended to be educational in nature. Nothing should be considered medical advice for your specific situation.

Transcript

Angie: 0:00

Welcome to the Real Life Runners podcast, episode number 385. Today, we're talking about motivation, that elusive thing that so many runners look for and think that they need in order to be consistent or achieve their goals. But today we want to talk about how motivation really isn't the answer. And there are other things that are much more important and much more effective for you to focus on so that you can achieve the goals that matter to you. stay tuned! What's up runners. Welcome to the show today. We're talking all about motivation, but not really because motivation is not the key. So spoiler alert, there's a lot of people out there that are always looking for motivation. there's motivational videos and there's motivational mantras and you can get yourself all hyped up with motivation to go out and crush a race. And sometimes it can be helpful. It's not that motivation is worthless. Motivation can be very helpful, especially. Right before a race or a big performance, but on a day to day basis, motivation is not the thing that we want to be depending on because consistency is the most important thing for us to develop as runners because consistency is what is going to lead to our biggest results. And if we're going to be consistent, we cannot rely on motivation every single day.

Kevin: 1:37

Great, but motivation can be super helpful for immediate benefits. if you're heading into a race, having that motivating fire up song, whatever video you want to watch, whatever gets you in the mood to race and compete, that's a great tactic. Like motivation is really great for short term things, like people get inspired at the start of the new year. They've got New Year's resolutions and the gyms are packed. Because people are motivated because they got it. They bought a new calendar. that's their, they keep forgetting how to write the date on everything they have to write a date on and it's motivating to go exercise except for when February hits.

Angie: 2:13

Yeah. Remember when you used to write checks and you used to, Always like that at least January probably into February you were like writing the old year on your checks And then you'd have to void them and rewrite them

Kevin: 2:24

I still have to sign a whole bunch of stuff for like kids permission slips for like different kids in my classes Yeah, so I screw up the date for all of January because yeah I don't get the first week like we're usually still off of school for several days into the next year and suddenly I'm writing the Date and I'm like what numbers am I even supposed to put on this? It's very confusing time for me

Angie: 2:43

Thank goodness that we don't write checks that much anymore, though. I don't know. every now and then I write a check and I have to think so much about it that I don't usually mess up the date because like, why am I writing a check right now? can't I just send a Zelle instead?

Kevin: 2:57

Can't our phones magically talk to each other?

Angie: 2:59

Have you done that thing? Recently, I know this is like a little aside is

Kevin: 3:03

definitely no,

Angie: 3:03

okay. Oh, yeah, that's right. You still have an iPhone eight. So your phone probably doesn't even do this thing. I

Kevin: 3:08

haven't been motivated to get a new phone lately.

Angie: 3:11

Lately, you mean in the last, what, seven years? Like how long has the iPhone eight been?

Kevin: 3:16

I don't know. I was just trying to bring it back to motivation. Okay.

Angie: 3:19

But there's this really cool thing where you can. by just bringing like the two, like the heads of the phones together and it does this weird woo like thing and there's this wave that goes over your phone and it's like the two phones are merging together it's wild

Kevin: 3:35

It sounds like when you're in Avatar having special time with each other where they woo and merge with each other Maybe I should try that with our daughter's science teacher and see if my iPhone 8 and his iPhone 8 would be able to Talk to each other

Angie: 3:50

Oh my gosh, I was, I'm glad you were talking about the iPhone eight and not the woo merging.

Kevin: 3:56

No, the iPhone

Angie: 3:58

was a little, I was going to get a bit creeped out.

Kevin: 4:01

No, but we have matching iPhone eights, which is fantastic.

Angie: 4:04

That's so funny. All right. So back to motivation. Okay. Motivation is a feeling, and this is what a lot of people may or may not understand. And I think that we, on some level, we do understand that motivation is a feeling, because it is a feeling that we often are trying to seek out. But I think that some of the, What we don't realize is that motivation, like all feelings, comes and goes, right? There's ups and there's downs, you're not always happy, you're not always excited, you're not always sad, you have different emotions and you experience different emotions in the course of any given day, any week, any month. So to think that you have to have motivation, For you to be consistent is really setting you up for inconsistency and all of the problems that inconsistency brings.

Kevin: 4:52

Because ultimately, as you pointed out at the beginning, consistency is essentially the only way to make giant progress is through small consistent steps day upon day. one of the issues with motivation is sometimes we get so motivated that we try and take a step way bigger than we should take. I remember being like a little kid. There was like a, this stretch in the lake that my grandparents lived on and you could cross over the water if you jumped on the rocks. And there were like five rocks from from the first part to the second part. And you could easily just Tip toe between and hit all five rocks. But then my cousin, who was a couple years older, tried to skip the first rock. And be like, oh no, you can jump over that one and then you land on the second one and go. So I tried to make the same too big of a first move because I was motivated. He inspired me to try it. Totally missed the rock. And then landed in the lake. some people get, Too motivated, too fired up. They're like, Oh, look at this amazing thing that I'm going to do and hurt themselves or, land in the lake

Angie: 5:49

or land in the lake. And I, it's like that graphic, where, I don't know if you've seen this graphic, it's like a side by side graphic of two ladders and like a person climbing each ladder. And on the one ladder, it's like the rungs of the ladder are very close together and the. little stick figure is climbing the ladder. And on the second ladder, the rungs are very far apart. And the little stick figure has a problem getting just from one rung to the next rung. And it's such a beautiful graphic because there's so many times that we want to just jump, right? We want to jump over this part. We want to make that quantum leap, whether it's in our fitness, in our health, in finances, in some other area of our life, in our career, in, whatever it might be. And we've so often forget that taking those little tiny consistent steps day after day, that's really what leads to the quantum leap over time. Because so often if you're just trying to leap ahead, and if you're trying to rely on motivation for you to pump yourself up and get these huge gains all in, a short amount of time, it's going to lead to that inconsistent results because you're not able to even reach the next rung. So by just scaling it back a little bit and deciding, okay, I don't need motivation. I need something else that's going to fuel My consistency, that's really a fantastic place to start. So if you're someone that is looking for motivation, seeking motivation, relying on motivation, I really want you to take this episode as a way for you to take a step back and say, okay, motivation is good. Sometimes that can be a useful tool. There's nothing wrong with trying to find some motivation. There are some days that it is very helpful. There are some days you do not feel like getting out the door and no matter how many videos you watch or how many Podcasts you listen to or how much music you put on you're just like I don't want to do it You know, I just am not into this today and on those days what do you lean into right and that's really what we want to talk about today because we want to tie a couple different things together a motivation is one of the things and Also, how do we get motivation? I think is another area that we want to explore because I think people often think that they have to have motivation in order to start doing the action, start doing the thing that they want to do, but. But there's a lot of very knowledgeable people out there in human performance that say it's the opposite. That motivation actually comes from action. Action does not come from motivation. Motivation comes from action. And so we want to jump into that part a little bit right now because that is a really important distinction for you to make and for you to understand to help people understand You move forward,

Kevin: 8:32

right? So this is like if you've been stuck for a while Sometimes people are like, oh, I haven't really got out and done anything. So it's so difficult It feels like the barrier to just get going is so high That you've got it that people are searching for some form of massive motivation to get them going But it's not But in fact, what would be helpful is to just start going so that you can then see, oh, look at this, I'm already doing the thing and it becomes a perpetuating cycle that direction.

Angie: 9:03

And that's where that graphic comes in handy, I think, is like just taking that little small step just to the next rung, not trying to jump up and quantum leap to, five rungs above or the second, the third rock instead of the second rock. You're just taking that one next step you're taking action and it's an action so small that doesn't really need Motivation right? Like I think that a lot of times we want to take these big action steps that Are so big that we have to pump ourselves up for them, but it's like how motivated do you really need to be to just put on your running shoes, right? To just walk out the door to commit to five minutes of running like that's how small can you get the action? So that you'll take that action that will then propel you to the next action to, to propel you to that next rung of the ladder because motivation comes from action and once you start taking the steps, once you get over those smaller hurdles, those smaller obstacles and put your shoes on and get out the door and start the run, then you'll probably be able to do it. Keep running, right? cause then you're already doing that thing. So the action has then spurred your motivation to continue doing that thing.

Kevin: 10:16

And then as you start doing the thing, you start seeing some actual visible, clear results, especially if the thing is pretty easy. Or you haven't been doing whatever the action is for a long period of time, then small little steps, we'll start getting really sizable results that we love to talk about this at the start of the cross country season is you can throw almost any training at a high school freshmen. And as long as they don't get hurt, they're going to get better because they're so untrained that everything works for them. if you haven't been training for an extended period of time, small little steps, we'll start seeing big. Results, or even if you've been running for years and then you took a long break, you're like, Oh, it's going to be so hard to get back in your body. Relearns how to do it way faster than it did the first time. So you take these small steps that you're like, it's so much lower than I used to be training. it's such a lower level. I'm just going out and I'm going for a five to 10 minute walk. I'm going for a run walk. I'm jogging part of it. And I used to be running five or six miles. That's okay. Your body is going to come back so fast because you don't ever fully lose the training that you had in the past. So you start taking these little steps. You start seeing the results. And now those results actually become motivation to continue to do the thing. So you made your own motivation.

Angie: 11:39

Because it's a loop. essentially what happens is, whatever circumstances you're in now, that's creating a thought or a belief in you. And if that belief is, this is too hard, or I have too far to go, it's going to be very hard for you to start taking the action that's then going to change your results, that's going to change your circumstances, right? And that's where we go back to those small steps, those little ladder rungs, like what is that next step? Because you're Motivation comes from action. Where does action come from? Action comes from belief. Action actually comes from your thoughts and your feelings, which then are rooted in a belief. So if you believe that you can do something, then you will actually go out and do the thing. When you do that thing, you will get results. And then that creates motivation to continue. So the first thing you need is belief. If you need to actually believe that you are capable. able to do this thing, because if you are thinking about, Hey, I want to run a marathon and no part of your body, no cell in your body believes that is possible, that's going to be a very difficult goal for you to accomplish. Not because you can't do it. It's because you don't believe that you can do it. And so when you don't believe it, your brain is you can't do that. And then your brain doesn't like to be wrong. So your brain will Do everything it can to prove itself correct. It believes you cannot do that thing and so it's going to protect you and keep you away from doing the things that will actually make that goal possible. So by making that goal smaller, bringing that back down to an action that's believable, Then you can start taking the steps that are going to move you towards that thing. And that's really what we want to talk about next. And hopefully now you understand, okay, I don't need motivation. It can be a helpful tool sometimes. But ultimately, if I want To cultivate motivation. It's not some feeling that I have to just pluck out of the sky or find on YouTube. This actually comes from the actions that I'm doing and the actions come from my thoughts and my beliefs. So how do we cultivate a new belief? If that is something that we need to get ourselves moving and get ourselves into action so that we can have more motivation, how do we actually start to cultivate that new belief of, okay, actually I think I can do this. Maybe this. isn't as hard as I think it is, right? Because if you're thinking constantly that this is so hard, doing this thing or achieving this goal is going to be so difficult, it's going to be very hard for you to do the actions that are going to be required for you to achieve that goal on a day in and day out basis.

Kevin: 14:16

So I think part of this has to do with where that goal is. So if your goal, if you put a goal out there of, running a marathon and you haven't ever run a step in your life, that sounds absurd and overwhelming. If you've been consistently running five K's and you put a goal of a marathon out there, that sounds really difficult. And it's a small distinction between, I have no idea how I'm going to do that. Yeah. But man, that'd be super cool if I did that. And I do currently run a few times a week. So maybe there's a process of getting from where I'm at to where I would like to go. But if you've never run before being like, yeah, marathon just sounds nuts. And it's possible that you could go from nothing to marathon. If you're

Angie: 14:59

21.

Kevin: 15:00

But it's totally, it's doable. If you can convince yourself that it's doable, the problem is sometimes that might be just such a big step that you make this goal because it sounds neat. And you've heard podcasts that are like, no, make giant goals. They're amazing. And they really motivate you and you make it and you're motivated for a week until the progress that you see. Is the progress that you would normally make an endurance running in a week, which is not massive. And now you're like, I've worked out for a week and all I've gotten is sore. And I still don't really see how I could get to a marathon. You went back to needing that motivation of a goal to be able to inspire the action. And it didn't get you there because the goal was so far out there.

Angie: 15:43

Exactly. And that's really where these smaller actions and smaller beliefs really come into play. So if there is a goal that you would like to accomplish and when you check in with yourself, your brain's yeah, no, like that is not, we are not able to do that. Then maybe we just need to shrink the goal down for the time being. That doesn't mean that you'll never achieve that goal. It means that when you get closer to that goal, when you go up the ladder and take on some, get past some of those lower rungs and you get closer to that goal, all of a sudden that thing becomes more possible, right? So if you've ever. Like you've probably experienced this already. if you are someone that's been running for a while and maybe you were running five Ks, the thought of a 10 K you're like, that's double the distance. That seems harder. But I think I could probably do it like versus if you're currently able to run five K and the thought of doing a marathon probably seems a lot further away. But once you get to a 10 K and you're like, okay, I'll just do a 10 K. Then once you get to the 10 K, all of a sudden, The half marathon doesn't seem that far away and then you get to the half marathon and all of a sudden you're like, the marathon that's double, but I didn't think I could make it this far, right? And so those bigger goals start to become more believable the closer you get to them. And. So how do we do that? We have to just make the belief a little bit smaller because those smaller beliefs and those smaller thoughts help to bridge the gap. And this is a technique that I really work with my clients on because so much of. anything that we do in our life is so based on our thoughts and our beliefs and our, what we, our mental state. And so inside of running through menopause, this is one of the big things that we go over. We actually just did this last week in week one, as we talked about, okay, where are you now? Where do you want to get to? Is that believable? Like on a scale of 1 to 10, how much do you believe that new thought that you want to have that new thing that's going to actually drive you towards your goals? Because if you're currently believing this is going to be so hard, there's no way that I can achieve that thing. It's gonna be very hard to jump to. I am 100 percent confident that I am able to achieve this goal, right? So we have to find something to bridge the gap. And that's really where these smaller thoughts and beliefs come to. Because Ultimately, when you, as you take the steps to that bigger goal, you're changing who you are, right? The old you that was able to, that was just sitting on the couch that wasn't running at all, that version of you was not capable of running a marathon, but all of a sudden you start running and you start training and now you're able to run a 5k, then you're able to run a 10k, then you're able to run a half marathon. And so you keep. Changing and forging this new identity and every step that you take, that action that you're taking creates more motivation and more evidence to support the new belief that you can do whatever that bigger goal is. And so by creating this new thought, this new belief through your actions, you start to. Build a new identity for yourself. And then all of a sudden you become the person who is now able to achieve that bigger goal,

Kevin: 19:05

right? I think a lot of people don't take that. That step back and see what's happening, that the results are literally transforming you on a mental side, that you now have different beliefs, different thoughts. So the idea of running such a long distance now seems Reasonable still very difficult. This doesn't mean that you're like, oh, yeah, no problem. This is gonna be a walk in the park It's still going to be difficult There's still gonna be difficult training going into it and if you make really big goals, it's possible that you actually don't achieve them That's the thing but it's now reasonable And a goal that is difficult, but something that you think, yes, I can achieve this is something that you are now willing to go after day. I think so many people get caught up in, I got a little bit of result and now I can get a little bit more result and a little bit more result. And they think that it's simply result, result snowball without taking the step back and realizing that result changes belief that then. Gets you more results, bigger results that gets you bigger beliefs. And now it's your belief window just keeps shifting. It's like the goalposts keep getting closer. So instead of now, kicking a 50 yarder to win the game, it's just, it's a little chip shot and you're like, Oh, that is still like a physical task that I have to accomplish, but it's much easier because it's a lot closer to where I currently am.

Angie: 20:24

Yeah. And here comes the kicker. The interesting part of all of this is that. it's like the old adage of what comes first, the chicken or the egg, right? What comes first, the action or the belief? And because you need both, like we just talked about, this is a feedback loop, right? So your action creates belief and then your belief drives your action. So it goes back and forth. So where do you start, right? I think that you have to start with some sort of belief to drive your action. And if you're really trying to achieve a goal, I would even say, It does start with your identity. It starts to with who you are choosing to be. And maybe the person that you are in this moment, like I mentioned before, you may be right now, who you are is not able to achieve the goal. That you have set for yourself and that's okay. That's what goals are for. Goals are there to help drive us, to give us a direction, to give us something to shoot for, to help motivate that transformation that we want, whether that's improved health, improved fitness, just to be a stronger person. If there's some others, goals of It's another identity that you want to achieve in your life. That's part of it is, the way that you achieve that thing and that is the transformation is the action steps that you have to take to get there. But the kind of ninja move that I really encourage my clients to do is to take on that identity first and to really start to step into that identity. And Start to make your decisions from the place of that new identity that you want to be like, what would that person be doing today? yes, I'm not that person quite yet because I am not able to do the things yet that person is able to do, But that person, what would that person be doing today? If that is really the timeline and the identity that I want to be, if that's really what I want my reality to look like, I have to start doing the actions today that are going to get me to that place down the road.

Kevin: 22:25

Yeah. And if you just keep driving yourself forward with external motivation along the way, when you get to whatever the thing is, we keep talking about putting a marathon out there when you get to a few hours into a marathon and everything is hurting and maybe your stomach's turned south and things are going, If all you've been relying on is external motivation, it's going to feel easier to stop at that point because the, all of the external motivation might not be there right now.

Angie: 22:57

Yeah. I would even argue that you, It would be very hard for you to even get to that point where you are actually in the marathon if you've been relying on motivation. Because on that day where it's rainy or it's cold or it's way too freaking hot and you are not looking forward to your run, those are the days. It's like during the training days where the motivation is going to be non existent. That you have to show up anyway because you're choosing to be the person that's going to achieve that goal. And

Kevin: 23:28

So on those days where it's hard to make the external motivation, drag you out there or put you onto a treadmill or whatever the workout is for that day, you're going to lose the consistency. And so then maybe you've already signed up for the race. So you show up to the race regardless, but along the way. Any time it got really difficult and there wasn't enough external motivation to do it, you chose backing out. in the race, when it gets difficult, what pattern have you already set up? you've established the pattern of, when it gets really hard and I don't have enough external motivation, that's when I back out. That's when I don't get all the way through. The last time I ran a hundred miles, this was super, super hard. And I had such a good training block, such a good training block. But the only other time I'd run a hundred miles, I stopped at 65. You have no idea how difficult mile 66 was. That was the first time that I had done that mile 67. I'm like, okay, now what is happening? I forget what mile that I made it to that I was so far off the pace and you looked at me and you're like we're just gonna keep going. We're here.

Angie: 24:34

that was at mile 60. Yeah. Like it was right before you got to 65 because It was getting there. Yeah, I think it's because it was coming. Yeah. But like at 60 when I met you in that place. Publix parking lot. I remember you were just like shaking your head like, I don't even, I don't know. this is going to take, we are going to be here. I am not going to be done by midnight. I think that's like when it started to hit you that you are not going to make that goal of being done by midnight. And I'm just like, okay. Like we're here, we're in this, and we're ready for it. Like whatever it takes.

Kevin: 25:04

And I had that like in my head, I'm like, we're going to cross the finish line. Whatever it takes, it's going to take a long time, but I really wanted to be done by midnight. And as soon as that goal was slipping away, it was tricky for me to be able to shift. And it was so helpful for you to help that shift occur because then I was able to keep going.

Angie: 25:23

That's when I stuck our daughter on you. I was like, you need to go run with dad. Like you need to run a mile. And she's I hate running. And I was like, your dad needs you go run one mile with your dad. And that I think was a boost for you.

Kevin: 25:39

it was certainly distracting from my own pain.

Angie: 25:42

Cause now you're coaching her.

Kevin: 25:44

Come on, we got to keep moving because the ability to move was coming in like spurts for me. So when it was like, all right, I can run it. Then I had to cover some ground because And in a couple of minutes, some shooting pain was going to come from my abdomen and I was going to have to take a walking break again.

Angie: 26:00

I couldn't run with you. So she had to step up because I was the only driver, like that was what it was like. And I told her, I said, I would do it, but I can't like, no one else can drive. I have to be the one driving and I'm not going to Run and then run back to the car and just leave you girls by yourself. that's not happening. So I need you to step up here. And she did.

Kevin: 26:18

Yeah. And it just, it got me over that hump and that doesn't mean that the rest of it was easy. It certainly was not, but I cleared that hurdle with some external help. And that's the thing. It wasn't necessarily external motivation. It was just some help from my. from my people. That's what I needed to be able to keep going, and it really was just a little small step. I needed to get the next mile in, because that meant I can do one more mile, and then I can do one more mile, and then I can do one more mile. that's literally how I made it to the end of that race, and by the end it was not mile, it was I can do, I can continue moving for the next minute for the last couple of hours, which made it really long.

Angie: 26:58

That's, that seems very long, yes. here's the thing that we want you to really understand if, just to hit this point home one more time, is that if your goal is so big that your brain is telling you there is no way that I can achieve this and you don't believe that goal is actually possible for you, it's going to It's pretty much impossible for you to achieve it. You have to believe it at even just a little bit, even just a fraction of a percentage. There has to be some sort of possibility in there because if you don't base your goal in some sort of reality, in some sort of belief that you can do it. Your brain's going to work against you the whole time until you quit. So if that goal is so big and your brain's that's when you got to scale it back. And you're like, okay, I can do this. And I love working with people on helping them really start to rewire their brains and their thinking because. I was just working with a client last week and she was getting, she was talking about, and this was such a fantastic question. I love this question so much. She's my brain is telling me that I'm tired all the time. and I'm, I am, like physically, I'm, I am tired. I am exhausted all of the time. How do I, Tell my brain, no, I'm not tired because I'm, I am tired. that is a true statement. And I was like, Oh, this is fantastic because it is true, right? it's not like we can just jump to I'm exhausted all of the time too. I have plenty of energy. I'm not tired at all. that's too big of a jump for our brains. So what is something smaller? What is something that you can believe that is a little bit closer? To the place that you want to go and that's where we get into those bridge thoughts and those bridge beliefs because once you start to find those That's what's going to get you to that next little step, to that next little rung. So then you can find the next thought, the next belief that will continue to move you in that direction. Then you can go and, use that identity that we talked about. It's okay, that person that does have more energy, that person that already ran that two hour half marathon, what is she doing today? What, how does she respond in this situation when her brain is telling her that she doesn't want to go out for a run when she has no energy? How is she responding in this situation? Because there are some times. Where you need to just push through and you need to do the thing even if you're exhausted and even if you don't have motivation and there's other times that it's very important for you to rest and listen to your body because That's what's better for you right now The better choice might be not to go on the run that day the better choice might be To sleep in and give your body the rest and the recovery that it needs So that you can get back at it the next day instead of running yourself into the ground even further

Kevin: 29:35

And, but that's the thing is so that you can get back at it the next day, not establishing a new habit of, I'm exhausted all the time. So I'm just going to take today off and I'm still tired the next day. So I'm going to take another day off and I'm still not really feeling great. So I'm going to take another day off. Like eventually it becomes a new pattern that you're establishing and now you're just not exercising anymore. Sometimes when I feel particularly exhausted and for years, I've paid great attention to how much I'm sleeping and making sure that I'm staying on top of that. But sometimes when I'm like, Ooh, I am going to be feel so tired in the morning. We stayed up late. There are times where I'm like, it's too late. And the way my schedule works out, I'm going to take tomorrow off. And then I'm going to be able to just knock it out for the rest of the week. And there are other times that I will push back and wake up. On the next morning and get in my run and then push the next day to recovery, knowing that I'm digging myself a little bit deeper, but saying, Hey, I don't feel great. This is not going to be a great run, but I'm still able to get it done. And it's one of those, it's it's a, you

Angie: 30:35

did that this weekend.

Kevin: 30:36

Yeah, a hundred percent. It was mental performance. I did not get the physical best out of that run, but I mentally got it done. And then. Planned an off day I just kicked the off day forward onto my schedule knowing that I'm still going to be able to recuperate and recover from it because I dug myself a little bit of a hole and it I didn't need the Physical run from it like it was not so dire to my training plan But being able to say I'm tired and I'm still gonna get up and do it That was more important for that particular aspect of training.

Angie: 31:09

Yeah. And I think that's really where it always comes in is like weighing that out of what's, what do I need to lean into right now? do I need to lean into the physical or do I need to lean into the mental part of it or the mental benefit that I'm going to achieve by doing this thing or not doing this thing? The last thing we really want to touch on here that Kevin brought up, like right before we started recording is this idea of timelines. because he brought up a great question. So I'll let you introduce this. And I said, let's talk about it. we'll just riff on it on the podcast because we love to do that. it's like you put a microphone into our normal conversations.

Kevin: 31:48

Yes. Yeah. It's a good topic. So the idea here is. that sometimes we put big goals out there, it's best to pull back from what the timeline is. you set a goal, but you release the timeline. Because one of the big things that people create issues with when setting goals is they set a goal and the time when it has to get taken care of. And so Or

Angie: 32:09

they like set the, they register first for the race. And then are like, Oh, shoot. Now I have to figure out how to train for this thing.

Kevin: 32:16

Yeah. So it's a goal that looks fantastic, but it's a super impractical timeline that leads to a whole heck of a lot of disappointment because the timeline doesn't make sense. And you love the phrase of set the goal, release the timeline. My issue is at some point as runners, if the goal is to PR at whatever the distance is at some point that we're not sure of new PRs are going to be out of reach. Can we still dive it like live in the world of set the goal release the timeline if that timeline Has an end point to it.

Angie: 32:51

I think yes, I think the answer is yes, and so good because I

Kevin: 32:54

wasn't sure That's why I wanted to ask the question So

Angie: 32:56

and we can talk about it because you might have a different thought than I do So I love set the goal release the timeline because I do think that we get so wrapped up on like I have to achieve this thing and I have to achieve this thing by this point in time because obviously I've already paid the money and I've already, signed up for this race or whatever it might be, or you just think, Oh, people set relatively arbitrary timelines of I said that I want to run my first marathon before I turned 40 or before I turned 50 or whatever it might be. But if you actually look at their training and their physical preparation and their mental preparation That timeline might not work out the best or it maybe It looks like it will at first and then life happens and who knows what goes on there are people that We've coached in the past that are just in great shape and they're on track and everything is looking great And then they're not Some life event happens like where a parent gets sick or someone passes away or they're dealing with a lot ton of stuff at work and all of a sudden they're traveling, five days out of the week and something just gets uprooted and their training goes off the rails and sometimes that happens and then all of a sudden, This goal that did seem very attainable is now a little bit more questionable, or in some cases, a lot more questionable, right? And I do think that there is this idea of yes, there will be a point in all of our lives, who knows when that is, for you, some of those PRs were like when you were 16 years old, or 18.

Kevin: 34:27

Hey, Mr. Brown, how fast can you run a mile? I'm like, right now, or when I was your age? Yeah.

Angie: 34:32

And so it is going to happen at different times for all of us. And we don't always know when the last fastest race is. And yeah, it

Kevin: 34:41

was 17. Yeah, I was seven freaking T it was the last century.

Angie: 34:47

Oh my gosh. But I think that, we do like to say if you fully believe in the result, if you know that. That this thing is achievable. If you just keep working towards it, does the timeline even matter? And I think that's really a great question for us to ask, because if you believe that you are capable of setting this new PR, maybe it's in speed, maybe it's in distance, does the timeline matter? And I think that then brings up the question, is it still fun for you to chase it? And that's really where I think It comes in because the timeline doesn't really matter if you're having fun, still chasing after it, if it becomes this like anxiety filled pressure that you're putting on yourself to achieve this thing by this certain date because, Oh no, I'm getting older and I, I'm not gonna be able to get faster. I'm not gonna be able to do this forever if it's like filled with anxiety and pressure. Is it really even the right goal for you in the first place? That's what I would ask, but if it's something that you're looking at and being like, yeah, this seems really fun to go chase and if I get it great and if not, I'm going to have a heck of a lot of fun chasing it and I'm going to really enjoy the person that I become in this pursuit. I still think that's a fantastic goal because I really think that. My, my idea and my perception of goals has really changed over the past few years because I always used to think that I would be a failure or it would be a failure if I didn't achieve the goal. But now I look at goals as, Directions and lighthouses for me to chase after and the attainment of the goal is not the sole purpose. It's the transformation. It's the journey. It's who I become in the process and all the things that I learned about myself and the new person that I become in that process that is the goal. The actual goal and the metric or whatever it is out there. That's just something tangible for, to keep driving me in that direction.

Kevin: 36:50

All right. So you literally flip the entire question around. So the timeline doesn't matter as long as you, you still enjoy the pursuit of that goal. Because if you design a goal and you form your belief around it correctly, it actually never really matters if you hit the goal itself. To go to your lighthouse metaphor, if you're in a. A boat and you're aiming towards a lighthouse and you actually hit the lighthouse, you have severely damaged your boat. And I know this is a metaphor that we use all the time of the lighthouse out there, but the lighthouse is, they're built on rocky cliffs. Like it's, you actually don't want to take your boat and hit it, hit the lighthouse with that's a, that's not going to go very well.

Angie: 37:30

you want to, in most cases you want to go past the lighthouse, right?

Kevin: 37:33

cause the lighthouse there, they're on the shore. Designed to let you know the coast is over here. Be careful. You're getting awfully close to the rocks Like that's really what the like it gives you something to aim for when it's really far away But as you get closer now, you have to figure out what is the very precise thing and that's why the big goals are Our lighthouse is out in the distance because it gives you a general direction. But then once you get closer, you want a more specific goal. That's and now I'd like to park my boat at that dock over there, which is, near the lighthouse, but not actually the lighthouse itself.

Angie: 38:08

Yeah. And sometimes those lighthouses are like out on rocks in the middle of the ocean and you have to go past the lighthouses to actually get to the dock too. Cause there are going to be some times where. Where you think that goal is your goal. And then you get there and you're like, Oh, this actually was just the step to my actual bigger goal. Like I actually have to go past this goal because I'm capable of more. And that sounds pretty darn cool. did you ever. I shouldn't say that cause I already know the answer. Dang it. I was going to say, did you ever think you were going to want to run a hundred miles? But the answer is yeah, because of your silly neighbor. You

Kevin: 38:42

have my silly neighbor.

Angie: 38:43

Your parents are like so annoyed by that idea.

Kevin: 38:47

It's totally my neighbor. but yeah, sometimes the lighthouse, in order to get into the park where the lighthouse is, you have to actually run past, past the lighthouse because the entrance is beyond it. And then you have to loop back to get to the lighthouse. And the hundred miler is actually like 101 miles. But apparently this is a common thing with ultra marathons is they're never actually a hundred.

Angie: 39:09

Oh my goodness. It sounds like that comes from experience.

Kevin: 39:12

Possibly. Maybe a very specific example.

Angie: 39:15

Yeah. hopefully this helps you understand that motivation is not the answer, that motivation comes from action. Your action comes from your belief and your thoughts and how you need to sometimes take those small action steps. To start to gain more belief in yourself, in the goal, in whatever it is, to then bring you into that new identity, that new person that is able to achieve the bigger thing that you want to achieve in your running, in your health, in your fitness, in your life. Because sometimes it seems that you're not going to be able to achieve the thing you want. And I know that so many of the women do that. That I work with in my perimenopause program. They just have this whole idea that like life is downhill from here, and that is so not the case. There's so much more life and running and joy and vibrancy and Awaiting you after menopause and it's going to be a such a beautiful journey as long as you go into it with the right Mindset and that's like a big part of what we do inside the program as well Along with all the physical things you need to do that to actually feel better

Kevin: 40:24

Yes, along with the actual physical actions that you need to take you fix the beliefs you get the actions You keep moving yourself forward, but your program is not just like motivational videos that you send out to everybody each morning That's not how it works.

Angie: 40:35

it is not so You We would love it. If you guys enjoyed this episode, we would love for you to please leave us a review on Apple podcasts. That's the best place for you to leave us a review. You can also leave. a rating on Spotify. If that's where you're listening to us, you can leave us a five star rating on Spotify, but Spotify does not allow you to write written reviews. Apple podcast does. And if you write us a written review on Apple podcasts, if you send me a screenshot or if you post it on social media and tag us at real life runners, I would love to send you a free real life runner sticker. So go ahead and do that. And I will Send you off a sticker. all you have to do is email me support@realliferunners.com. actually you can use hello@realliferunners.com. That will get us, get to the right place. So hello@realliferunners.com. Just send me a picture of your screenshot or you can tag me on social media at real life runners with, your review, with a screenshot of your review. And we would love to thank you by sending you a sticker. Thanks as always for joining us. This has been the Real Life Runners podcast, episode number 385. Now get out there and run your life.